Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us
Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network
Home
Discussion GroupsEnglish UsageBritish EnglishESL Teaching
Learnglish.com
Contact UsLink To UsSearch & Site Map

Discussion Groups / English Usage / January 2004



Tip: Looking for answers? Try searching our database.

Two items: A letter to the editor and an e-mail to McDonald's Corporation

Thread view: 
Enable EMail Alerts  Start New Thread
Thread rating: 
Raymond S. Wise - 03 Jan 2004 06:54 GMT
In fact, both were e-mails, but the one to the St. Paul Pioneer Press was
printed in its "Letters to the Editor" section. It is currently available on
the Internet under the title "Humane treatment" at

http://www.twincities.com/mld/twincities/7608339.htm

In it, I took exception to a statement made by a previous writer of a letter
to the editor who had said "The death penalty is not inhumane when the
criminal is no longer human!"

As for the e-mail to McDonald's Corporation, back in November McDonald's CEO
Jim Cantalupo wrote an open letter to Merriam-Webster protesting the entry
"McJob" in the 11th edition of *Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary.* On
November 9, I wrote an e-mail to McDonald's in which I protested that the
lexicographers were doing what they were supposed to be doing, representing
how a word is actually used. I also quoted the entry in the 11th Collegiate
for "Mc-," something I also did in a post to alt.usage.english .

I ended my post by saying, "Note that I am not advocating the use of either
'McJob' or 'Mc' in the sense given. I am instead advocating that dictionary
makers present words as they are actually used and that you not attempt to
persuade them to distort dictionary entries when those entries accurately
report how a word is used."

I was not particularly surprised when the reply I received on November 20,
from an employee of the McDonald's Customer Satisfaction Department,
appeared to be a piece of boilerplate which presumed that I thought the
Collegiate's definition of "McJob" represented actual jobs at McDonald's.

I thought the following passage was interesting, particularly the "review"
reference:

[quote]

The information contained in this e-mail and any accompanying documents is
confidential, may be privileged, and is intended solely for the person
and/or entity to whom it is addressed (i.e. those identified in the "To" and
"cc" box). They are the property of McDonald's Corporation. Unauthorized
review,use, disclosure, or copying of this communication, or any part
thereof, is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.

[end quote]

Lawyers? Is there no provision for fair use in such a case? I edited this
letter to paraphrase the beginning of the e-mail I received from McDonald's
instead of actually quoting what the employee wrote. But the above warning
is, of course, quoted from the e-mail itself.

Signature

Raymond S. Wise
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA

E-mail: mplsray @ yahoo . com

R F - 03 Jan 2004 18:15 GMT
> As for the e-mail to McDonald's Corporation, back in November McDonald's CEO
> Jim Cantalupo wrote an open letter to Merriam-Webster protesting the entry

Oy! (Sorry.)

> "McJob" in the 11th edition of *Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary.* On
> November 9, I wrote an e-mail to McDonald's in which I protested that the
[quoted text clipped - 31 lines]
> instead of actually quoting what the employee wrote. But the above warning
> is, of course, quoted from the e-mail itself.

The warning is a catchall thing, designed to cover all sorts of
potentially bad things, some of which obviously don't apply here.

The labelling of the information in the e-mail as "confidential" is
probably meaningless, unless you have some special relationship to
McDonald's that you're not disclosing here.  Once he decided to say
anything to a stranger like you, any characterizing of the communication
as "confidential" is just plain silly except to the extent that it's
suggesting that he only meant to talk to you and not, say, some other
guy.  However, when you get a non-confidential (in the usual sense)
e-mail like this, you can be expected to pass on its contents to the
whole rest of the world.

As for the information being the property of McDonald's, that depends on
whether the information actually is the property of McDonald's.  I don't
see how fair use comes into play here, since a supposedly "confidential"
letter isn't subject to copyright in the first place.  This letter hasn't
been "published" by McDonald's.  (By contrast, a Usenet posting
gets copyright protection, though it can, of course, be waived, as in
fact is routinely done in the case of Mark Brader's postings [at least
with respect to the *text* in his articles].)  I think any proprietary
interest they had in the information contained in this e-mail was
surrendered when they decided not to keep it to themselves but instead to
share it with you, Joe Schoe Wise.

I think one thing that's clear is that they don't want you to pass on what
was communicated to the rest of the world, like us.  But whether you want
to go against their wishes and do so is probably up to you.  I mean, this
is a free country, not like *some* countries where if you go against a big
powerful corporation like McDonald's they'll go and sue you for libel.
Have it your way, even though they're not lovin' it.
Raymond S. Wise - 03 Jan 2004 19:32 GMT
> > As for the e-mail to McDonald's Corporation, back in November McDonald's CEO
> > Jim Cantalupo wrote an open letter to Merriam-Webster protesting the entry
>
> Oy! (Sorry.)

Are you objecting to my having written "protesting the entry" instead of
"protesting against the entry"?

From the entry for the verb "protest" in the *Merriam-Webster's Collegiate
Dictionary,* 11th ed.:

"transitive verb [...] 3 : to make a statement or gesture in objection to
<_protested_ the abuses of human rights>"

> > "McJob" in the 11th edition of *Merriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary.* On
> > November 9, I wrote an e-mail to McDonald's in which I protested that the
[quoted text clipped - 38 lines]
> probably meaningless, unless you have some special relationship to
> McDonald's that you're not disclosing here.  Once he decided to say

I had a special relationship that I wasn't aware of. I was unable to find
any way to e-mail McDonald's Corporation except through an e-mail program at
their site. I just went back there and took a look at its "McDonald's
Internet Site Terms and Conditions" page at

http://www.mcdonalds.com/terms.html

where I found the following:

[quote]

SUBMISSIONS

All remarks, suggestions, ideas, graphics, or other information communicated
to McDonald's through this site (together, the "Submission") will forever be
the property of McDonald's. McDonald's will not be required to treat any
Submission as confidential, and will not be liable for any ideas for its
business (including without limitation, product, or advertising ideas) and
will not incur any liability as a result of any similarities that may appear
in future McDonald's operations. Without limitation, McDonald's will have
exclusive ownership of all present and future existing rights to the
Submission of every kind and nature everywhere. Except as noted below in
this paragraph, McDonald's will be entitled to use the Submission for any
commercial or other purpose whatsoever without compensation to you or any
other person sending the Submission. Personally identifiable information
that may be received at this site is provided voluntarily by a visitor to
this site. This information is for internal purposes only and is not sold or
otherwise transferred to third parties of McDonald's or to other entities
who are not involved in the operation of this site. Information submitted
via a number of areas in this site, for instance, Write to Ronald, is not
retained. Therefore, the above right to use Submissions is subject to this
limited use of this information and excludes non-retained information. You
acknowledge that you are responsible for whatever material you submit, and
you, not McDonald's have full responsibility for the message, including its
legality, reliability, appropriateness, originality, and copyright.

[end quote]

According to that, my quoting the last two sentences of my own e-mail to
McDonald's was a violation of these terms and conditions, as is, I imagine,
quoting from the terms and conditions page itself.

There's a valuable lesson here. Sometimes snail-mail is preferable.

> anything to a stranger like you, any characterizing of the communication
> as "confidential" is just plain silly except to the extent that it's
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> surrendered when they decided not to keep it to themselves but instead to
> share it with you, Joe Schoe Wise.

Shouldn't that be "Joe Schmoe Wise"? I see that the 11th Collegiate has "Joe
Blow" and "Joe Six-Pack," and "schmo" (with the equal variant spelling
"schmoe"), but it doesn't have "Joe Schmo" or "Joe Schmoe."

> I think one thing that's clear is that they don't want you to pass on what
> was communicated to the rest of the world, like us.  But whether you want
> to go against their wishes and do so is probably up to you.  I mean, this
> is a free country, not like *some* countries where if you go against a big
> powerful corporation like McDonald's they'll go and sue you for libel.
> Have it your way, even though they're not lovin' it.

Signature

Raymond S. Wise
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA

E-mail: mplsray @ yahoo . com

Larry Trask - 04 Jan 2004 17:19 GMT

> Are you objecting to my having written "protesting the entry" instead of
> "protesting against the entry"?
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> "transitive verb [...] 3 : to make a statement or gesture in objection to
> <_protested_ the abuses of human rights>"

Traditionally, 'protest' is intransitive, and you must 'protest
against' something.  But the verb has come to be used transitively in
American English, and I believe all or most American commentators
regard the transitive use as standard.

But the transitive use is still uncommon in British English, and
British commentators object to it.  However, I suspect that the
American usage won't take long to establish itself on this side of the
pond.

Larry Trask
larryt@sussex.ac.uk
Matti Lamprhey - 04 Jan 2004 21:19 GMT
"Larry Trask" <larryt@sussex.ac.uk> wrote...
> "Raymond S. Wise" <illinoisNOSPAM@mninter.net> wrote...
>
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
> American usage won't take long to establish itself on this side of the
> pond.

Those who object to this new transitive usage may have in mind that
there is already a directly conflicting one:  to protest one's
innocence.  That ought to suffice as a bulwark against the incomer, but
I suspect we'll soon be able to add "protest" to our list of words which
can be used to convey directly opposing senses.

Matti
 
Sign In
Join
My Latest Posts
My Monitored Threads
My Blog
My Photo Gallery
My Profile
My Homepage

Start New Thread
Enable EMail Alerts
Rate this Thread



©2012 Advenet LLC   Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.