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Discussion Groups / English Usage / July 2009The screaming Abdabs!
I've heard that mentioned over the years, but it's not in any of my dictionaries - does anyone know it's etymology off the top of their heads? :-D Nick On 09 Jun 2009, Nick wrote > I've heard that mentioned over the years, but it's not in any of my > dictionaries - does anyone know it's etymology off the top of their > heads? :-D the OED has it from 1946 (also as "habdabs"), with "origin obscure"; my guess would be it's from the cartoon noise made by a gibbering idiot.  SignatureCheers, Harvey CanEng and BrEng, indiscriminately mixed > it's etymology I won't chide you for your misplaced apostrophe. Good old Eric Partridge in his Dictionary of Slang and Unconventional English, gives "ab-dabs" as World War II slang for a tall tale, as well as "an attack of delirium tremens". He dates the phrase "screaming ab-dabs" to about 1950. In message <42050b9d-307a-41c6-9896-eb8fc75543e4@c9g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>, contrex <mike.j.harvey@gmail.com> writes >> it's etymology > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >of delirium tremens". He dates the phrase "screaming ab-dabs" to about >1950. If the condition becomes serious, it may turn into the "screaming heebie-jeebies and the howling habdabs". Very nasty. SignatureIan On Jun 9, 4:37 pm, Ian Jackson <ianREMOVETHISjack...@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote: > In message > <42050b9d-307a-41c6-9896-eb8fc7554...@c9g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>, [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > heebie-jeebies and the howling habdabs". Very nasty. > -- ~ <g> It's something close to the way a pal pronounced 'asterisks' on a computer course - he said, 'asTERicks'! Nick from England > On Jun 9, 4:37 pm, Ian Jackson > <ianREMOVETHISjack...@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > <g> It's something close to the way a pal pronounced 'asterisks' on a > computer course - he said, 'asTERicks'! Was he leaning against an obelix? SignatureJohn Dean Oxford > > On Jun 9, 4:37 pm, Ian Jackson > > <ianREMOVETHISjack...@g3ohx.demon.co.uk> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Was he leaning against an obelix? ~ LOL Nick from England > <g> It's something close to the way a pal pronounced 'asterisks' on a > computer course - he said, 'asTERicks'! Mary had an aeroplane In it she used to frisk Wasn't she a silly girl Her little * SignatureThe Canadian Curmudgeon (in Calgary) Save our precious CO2 - plant many trees > > <g> It's something close to the way a pal pronounced 'asterisks' on a > > computer course - he said, 'asTERicks'! [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Wasn't she a silly girl > Her little * ~ <g> good one! Nick from England >> it's etymology > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > of delirium tremens". He dates the phrase "screaming ab-dabs" to about > 1950. In my copy of Partridge (8th Ed.) he has no hyphen in 'abdabs'. He places it "C.20, esp WW2" for "don't come [/] give me the old abdabs." He notes that abdabs in WW2 was occasionally used for afters. 'delirium tremens' is specifically the *screaming* abdabs and is from the late 1930s. The 'hab-dabs' variant (this time *with* hyphen) he dates from ca 1942. Apart from that your edition and my edition of Eric P are in harmony. SignatureJohn Dean Oxford > >> it's etymology > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > John Dean > Oxford Why do I hear the phrase in Cary Grant's voice? >>>> it's etymology >> [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Why do I hear the phrase in Cary Grant's voice? I don't know, why *are* you hearing the phrase "in Cary Grant's voice"? OH! I see what you mean. May well be Sir Archibald used the line. Or Tony Curtis used it for him. IMDb only has it credited to "Billy Liar" - "William Terrence 'Billy' Fisher: [Billy swallows some] Eh, steady on! They'll give yuh the screamin' abdabs. One of these, two two-and-nines at the Regal, bag of chips and you're away!" SignatureJohn Dean Oxford >>> it's etymology >> I won't chide you for your misplaced apostrophe. Good old Eric [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > The 'hab-dabs' variant (this time *with* hyphen) he dates from ca 1942. > Apart from that your edition and my edition of Eric P are in harmony. Huh? What do you mean, "used for afters"? SignatureMarshall Price of Miami marshallprice@att.net http://marshallprice.wordpress.com >>>> it's etymology >>> I won't chide you for your misplaced apostrophe. Good old Eric [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >> > Huh? What do you mean, "used for afters"? The word "abdabs" is sometimes used in place of "afters". It is a food reference. OED afters, n. pl. colloq. (formerly only dial. and vulg.). The course which follows the main course of a meal. 1909 J. R. WARE Passing Eng. 3/1 Afters (Devon), sweets{em}pies and puddings. Bring in the afters is a common satirical remark in poor Devonshire houses, especially when there are no afters to follow. Also used in Scotland, e.g., Hey mon, a dinner, an' nae afters! 1919 Athenæum 29 Aug. 822/2 Afters is in no sense an army word..beyond the fact that the mass of the army is composed of the working classes... Used in its equivalent sense to sweets, pudding, entremets or dessert, it may not show much imagination. 1940 Manchester Guardian Weekly 11 Oct. 255 The meat course costs from fourpence to sixpence, and the afters, as Londoners call puddings, from twopence to threepence. .... 1953 SCOTT & FISHER 1,000 Geese x. 120 We ate our corned beef and cheese, crisp-bread and biscuits, with dates for afters. SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.english.usage) >>> He notes that abdabs in WW2 was occasionally used for afters. >>> >> Huh? What do you mean, "used for afters"? > > The word "abdabs" is sometimes used in place of "afters". It is a food > reference. I wouldn't worry, Peter. Marshall only wakes up a week or two after the thread is closed. He'll be asleep again now. SignatureJohn Dean Oxford >>>> He notes that abdabs in WW2 was occasionally used for afters. >>>> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >I wouldn't worry, Peter. Marshall only wakes up a week or two after the >thread is closed. He'll be asleep again now. I noticed a frenzy of activity. SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.english.usage) >>>>> He notes that abdabs in WW2 was occasionally used for afters. >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > I noticed a frenzy of activity. That's right. Two weeks zzz < - - frenzy - - > Two weeks zzz SignatureJohn Dean Oxford > That's right. > > Two weeks zzz < - - frenzy - - > Two weeks zzz Can somebody with better references demystify why zzz denotes sleeping/snoring? The only explanation I found in e.g. wikipedia, was that it is onomatopoeic from snoring. But zzz sounds nothing like snoring! The immitative sounds for snoring should contain the 'ch' from "loch" and the rolling 'r', as do the words for "snore" in all non-English languages I know - German, Russian and Bulgarian. Why z? SignatureYou'd be crazy to e-mail me with the crazy. But leave the div alone. >> That's right. >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >non-English languages I know - German, Russian and Bulgarian. > Why z? I'm not sure. As you say it is not representative of the sound of snoring while breathing through the nose. A few people will breath out noisily through almost-closed lips which can vibrate rapidly producing a sound that sometimes higher-pitched. That might be the origin of zzzz to represent snoring. SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.english.usage) >> That's right. >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > non-English languages I know - German, Russian and Bulgarian. > Why z? Some people do a choking or snorting kind of snore, but just the other day, as I walked down the avenue, I noticed a man lying on the grass verge, just at the time a car came up beside me and was slowing down to stop beside the man. I got to the man just as the driver got out of the car, but I was able to tell the would-be Good Samaritan that, like Lazarus, the man was asleep. He had the gentlest of snores, which amazed me, because, one hour after a shower, lying on the wet grass had to be most uncomfortable, and he had to have been out of his mind drunk. He must have been inside during the rain, because his clothing looked dry. Most passed-out drunks in my experience have snorting, guttural snores. Oh, yes. I left him lying there. He looked very comfortable. And I think the driver felt the same, as I did not hear the sirens indicating police or ambulance as I went on down the way. Twenty minutes later, as I walked back home, the man was gone. Let sleeping drunks lie. Patok <crazy.div.patok@gmail.com> wrote in news:h1oup7$70j$1 @news.eternal-september.org: >> That's right. >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > non-English languages I know - German, Russian and Bulgarian. > Why z? I think 'zzz' probably originated in, or at least, was popularized by strip cartoons. I don't know why 'zzz' was chosen, and it annoyed me as a child that it didn't sound anything like snoring. Yes, 'rrr' might have been a better choice, but it would be amusing to see a speech bubble containing '"ch" as in "loch" "ch" as in "loch" "ch" as in "loch"'! Peter >> That's right. >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > non-English languages I know - German, Russian and Bulgarian. > Why z? I'm pretty sure there is some extensive research in the archives of aue. From the OED entry for 'z', the letter was used to denote a sawing or buzzing noise. Snoring noises were seen as similar to sawing or buzzing and the term leaped the barrier. eg: "1852 Thoreau Summer 15 June, The dry z-ing of the locust is heard. 1884 R. W. Buchanan New Abelard i, The bats were seen flitting with thin z-like cry high up over the waterside. ... 1902 S. E. White Blazed Trail ii, The rhythmical z-z-z! z-z-z! [of the saw]. 1909 H. G. Wells Tono-Bungay i. ii. 67 He had a way of drawing air in at times through his teeth that gave a whispering zest to his speech. It's a sound I can only represent as a soft Zzzz. Ibid. iii. ii. 326 He meditated for a time and Zzzzed softly. 1924 Dialect Notes V. 259 Z-z-z (buzzing, or snoring)." To add to your international collection, French has 'ronfler' (cf their cat-speak word 'ronron') and Spanish 'roncar' SignatureJohn Dean Oxford >> That's right. >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > non-English languages I know - German, Russian and Bulgarian. > Why z? I have a hunch it first appeared in cartoons ("comic strips"), where space was limited. Not that that explains it, though! SignatureMarshall Price of Miami marshallprice@att.net http://marshallprice.wordpress.com >>>>> He notes that abdabs in WW2 was occasionally used for afters. >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > I noticed a frenzy of activity. I blame the quart-and-a-half of coffee. SignatureMarshall Price of Miami marshallprice@att.net http://marshallprice.wordpress.com >>>> He notes that abdabs in WW2 was occasionally used for afters. >>>> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > I wouldn't worry, Peter. Marshall only wakes up a week or two after the > thread is closed. He'll be asleep again now. I resumed following alt.english.usage by "catching up" messages more than a couple weeks old, but who knows when I'll fall asleep next? I was supposed to go on a three-week ocean voyage today in a new forty-four foot sailboat, but my plans evaporated inexplicably. The cellphone number I'd been given was suddenly unreachable. :( SignatureMarshall Price of Miami marshallprice@att.net http://marshallprice.wordpress.com >>>>> He notes that abdabs in WW2 was occasionally used for afters. >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > forty-four foot sailboat, but my plans evaporated inexplicably. The > cellphone number I'd been given was suddenly unreachable. :( Ah. An intriguing philosophical issue. How do you know the number was *suddenly* unreachable? Maybe it had become unreachable within 30 seconds of the last time you were able to reach it but you just hadn't noticed. Maybe it vacillated between reachable and unreachable until it gave up just before you called. Forty four foot? That's for cissies. William Bligh travelled 3,000 miles in a 23 footer. SignatureJohn Dean Oxford >>>>>> He notes that abdabs in WW2 was occasionally used for afters. >>>>>> [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > it vacillated between reachable and unreachable until it gave up just before > you called. Somebody I'd just met last week invited me to help him sail his boat home to Seattle, and gave me his cellphone number. I told him I'd be out of town overnight, and he agreed to put off leaving until I got back. But I wound up being away two nights, and when I got back, I discovered, all of a sudden, that his number wasn't working. I doubt philosophers have sufficient spare time to take up such trivia. It's hard enough distinguishing the real from the ideal. > Forty four foot? That's for cissies. William Bligh travelled 3,000 miles in > a 23 footer. I recall reading that somebody crossed the Atlantic in a six-foot boat. And in general, the smaller the boat, the safer. Still, single-handing a 44-footer would be a new experience for me. SignatureMarshall Price of Miami marshallprice@att.net http://marshallprice.wordpress.com > Still, > single-handing a 44-footer would be a new experience for me. Now *there's* a motto you could have engraved on a brass plate and attached to the woodwork. SignatureJohn Dean Oxford >> Still, single-handing a 44-footer would be a new experience for me. > > Now *there's* a motto you could have engraved on a brass plate and attached > to the woodwork. As usual, I don't get it. :( SignatureMarshall Price of Miami marshallprice@att.net http://marshallprice.wordpress.com > > it's etymology > > I won't chide you for your misplaced apostrophe. ~ <g> I'm *always* doing that and realising my mistake after! ~ > Good old Eric > Partridge in his Dictionary of Slang and Unconventional English, gives > "ab-dabs" as World War II slang for a tall tale, as well as "an attack > of delirium tremens". He dates the phrase "screaming ab-dabs" to about > 1950. ~ Thanks, but did you know what it meant? Nick from England > Thanks, but did you know what it meant? Of course I did. My mother born 1920, who served in the Women's Royal Air Force throughout World War II, would say "You kids are giving me the screaming bloody abdabs!" when we were particularly fractious. Why did you ask? > > Thanks, but did you know what it meant? > > Of course I did. My mother born 1920, who served in the Women's Royal > Air Force throughout World War II, would say "You kids are giving me > the screaming bloody abdabs!" when we were particularly fractious. Why > did you ask? ~ I just wondered if you had to look it up. I never knew what an Abdab was. Nick from England |
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