 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
| HomeDiscussion GroupsEnglish UsageBritish EnglishESL Teaching Learnglish.com Contact UsLink To UsSearch & Site Map |
Discussion Groups / English Usage / November 2006Is this group, where is possible to talk in English?
Someone wrote in Finnish: Jos jatkat ryhmässä "finet.ryhmat" edes yhden viestin verran tuolla uudelleen aloittamallasi haistattelulinjalla niin sovellan äärimmäisen ovelaa menetelmääni jatkossa myös kaikkiin sinun viesteihisi. And same message in English is like (I think so): If you keep on group "finet.ryhmat" at least amount one message over there again sniff-line whose you started, I will apply my extreme clever method on extention too all your messages. ------------------------------------------------------- I think, that university person mean cancel-message(s), so I want to take look at some chat-like group, where I can talk. I have bad memories alt.alt.alt.alt.alt (or alt5) -group, so can I talk here (this group) If I try write here calmly tone? Oh, I forgot, I can't write every time in English literally. ;-)  SignatureKaikkea lukemaansa ei kannata uskoa. Käy täällä: www.isoallo.net > Someone wrote in Finnish: > Jos jatkat ryhmässä "finet.ryhmat" edes yhden viestin [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > Kaikkea lukemaansa ei kannata uskoa. > Käy täällä: www.isoallo.net This is a group for discussing English-language matters. Is there a question in your post? >> I think, that university person mean cancel-message(s), >> so I want to take look at some chat-like group, where [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > This is a group for discussing English-language matters. Is there a > question in your post? One, is on Usenet any groups (English), where is possible to chat? SignatureWell... All comments are welcome too. > >> I think, that university person mean cancel-message(s), > >> so I want to take look at some chat-like group, where [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > One, is on Usenet any groups (English), where is possible to > chat? There are thousands of English-language groups. This one is about English-language matters. Is that something in which you have an interest? >>>> I think, that university person mean cancel-message(s), >>>> so I want to take look at some chat-like group, where [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > English-language matters. Is that something in which you have an > interest? I just like to talk about interests, hobbies and so on. SignatureWell... All comments are welcome too. As we all stood and listened, Kesti Pauli sung the following words: > > > One, is on Usenet any groups (English), where is possible to > > > chat? [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > I just like to talk about interests, hobbies and so on. But *what* interests, hobbies, and so on? SignatureA. Gwilliam To e-mail me, replace "bottomless_pit" with "devnull" > As we all stood and listened, Kesti Pauli sung the following words: > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > But *what* interests, hobbies, and so on? About photos (digital), numismatics, and movies. SignatureWell... All comments are welcome too. > > As we all stood and listened, Kesti Pauli sung the following words: > >> I just like to talk about interests, hobbies and so on. > > > > But *what* interests, hobbies, and so on? > > About photos (digital), numismatics, and movies. None of these are on-topic for AUE, unless you have a question or comment about English usage in relation to these hobbies of yours. You'll have to look elsewhere to find some place appropriate for discussing them. -=Eric Kesti Pauli skrev: >>> I think, that university person mean cancel-message(s), >>> so I want to take look at some chat-like group, where [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > One, is on Usenet any groups (English), where is possible to > chat? There are no chat groups on Usenet. > Kesti Pauli skrev: >>>> I think, that university person mean cancel-message(s), [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] >> > There are no chat groups on Usenet. But dozens of alt.binaries.pictures groups. ;-) SignatureWell... All comments are welcome too. > Someone wrote in Finnish: > Jos jatkat ryhmässä "finet.ryhmat" edes yhden viestin [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Oh, I forgot, I can't write every time in English literally. ;-) You're welcome to post in English here. Many people will prefer a calm tone. You're especially welcome to post /about/ English here. However, discussions often go off topic, and I encourage you to participate in those, too, to read more English and to practice your own. Some people may disagree with me on that subject. People here will feel free to correct your English--not true in most groups. I suggest that you say whether you want corrections or not. I admit that few people follow my suggestion, though. "Isoallo"? Do you know Big Al? SignatureJerry Friedman >> Someone wrote in Finnish: >> Jos jatkat ryhmässä "finet.ryhmat" edes yhden viestin [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > "Isoallo"? Do you know Big Al? It's me itself. Big Al was my former nickname on newsgroups, but I want use to my own name, Pauli Kesti. Reason? Reason is that: I was heared, that people who use their own name, so person who use his own name, takes more serious(ly). SignatureWell... All comments are welcome too. Kesti Pauli skrev: >>> Oh, I forgot, I can't write every time in English literally. ;-) >> You're welcome to post in English here. Many people will prefer a [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > I was heared, that people who use their own name, so person who > use his own name, takes more serious(ly). I guessed that you were "Big Al". Apparently, you have not taken any lessons since you were "Big Al" here. It's not enough to have a Finnish-English dictionary. You have to know something about sentence structure, tenses, word order, etc, etc. The Lars Enderin entity posted thusly: >I guessed that you were "Big Al". Apparently, you have not taken any >lessons since you were "Big Al" here. It's not enough to have a >Finnish-English dictionary. You have to know something about sentence >structure, tenses, word order, etc, etc. I received a book in the mail yesterday, as payment for the use of one of my photographs in it. It's written in Norwegian, and I thought I'd try to figure out a few paragraphs using the "freelang.com's" Norwegian/English dictionary. What I noticed right away was that many of the words seem to be present in a "shortened" form, which could be due to various ending for different cases, but could also be due to them being compound words, or even that they don't happen to be in the list. Coupling this with sentence structure differences, it looks as if I might be able to gain no more than a general sense of what is being said, and of course, were I to attempt to write something in Norwegian, it is likely that it would read, to a Norwegian, a lot like Lars' posting does to us. Oleg Lego skrev: > The Lars Enderin entity posted thusly: > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > Norwegian, it is likely that it would read, to a Norwegian, a lot like > Lars' posting does to us. I guess you meant Pauli's posting(s)? Finnish sentence structure is very different from English, Norwegian, or Swedish, because Finnish belongs to a very different language group. The Lars Enderin entity posted thusly: >Oleg Lego skrev: >> The Lars Enderin entity posted thusly: [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] >Finnish sentence structure is very different from English, Norwegian, or >Swedish, because Finnish belongs to a very different language group. Yes, I did. Sorry. Just ut of curiosity, what other languages are in the Finnish group? >The Lars Enderin entity posted thusly: >>I guess you meant Pauli's posting(s)? >>Finnish sentence structure is very different from English, Norwegian, or [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Just ut of curiosity, what other languages are in the Finnish group? Estonian and Hungarian. I think that Finnish and Estonian are quite close, so that Finns and Estonians can understand each other with care. Those two and Hungarian are further apart. The group used to be known as "Finno-Ugric", but these labels change faster than I can keep track of, and I'm definitely not keeping up. SignatureGraeme Thomas >>Just ut of curiosity, what other languages are in the Finnish group? > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > The group used to be known as "Finno-Ugric", but these labels change > faster than I can keep track of, and I'm definitely not keeping up. Ethnologue disagrees, making Finnic and Finno-Ugric two separate groups within Uralic, and placing only Hungarian in Finno-Ugric. Finnic, however, contains Estonian, three varieties of Finnish, Ingrian, Karelian, Liv (spoken in Latvia, by the way), and several smaller languages spoken by various national groups in Russia. SignatureAlec St.Petersburg, Russia [30E18 59N56] >>>Just ut of curiosity, what other languages are in the Finnish group? >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >Ingrian, Karelian, Liv (spoken in Latvia, by the way), and several >smaller languages spoken by various national groups in Russia. Pal Engel, in "The Realsm of St. Stephen", says this of the Hungarians: "Their language belongs to the eastern - that is, Ugric - branch of the Finno-Ugric family of languages, its closest relatives being Vogul and Ostyak, spoken by two small peoples who until recently lived off fishing and hunting in the northwestern corner of Siberia. Their relationship with Hungarian, however, is not much closer, and no more evident for non-experts, than that bwtween, say, English and Welsh." SignatureDon Aitken Mail to the From: address is not read. To email me, substitute "clara.co.uk" for "freeuk.com" >> The group used to be known as "Finno-Ugric", but these labels change >> faster than I can keep track of, and I'm definitely not keeping up. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >Ingrian, Karelian, Liv (spoken in Latvia, by the way), and several >smaller languages spoken by various national groups in Russia. Thanks. I knew that my knowledge wasn't current. As I understand matters there are a lot of languages in the Uralic group, with many of them spoken by only a few hundred people. SignatureGraeme Thomas >> The Lars Enderin entity posted thusly: > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > close, so that Finns and Estonians can understand each other with > care. Those two and Hungarian are further apart. Yeah, many Estonian words are so easy understand what they mean, like: "ravista" (shake) is in Estonian language: "loksutada". Hungarian language is also same group, because they says word just as they are written (or wrotten?). > The group used to be known as "Finno-Ugric", but these labels change > faster than I can keep track of, and I'm definitely not keeping up. SignatureWell... All comments are welcome too. } Graeme Thomas wrote: ... }> Estonian and Hungarian. I think that Finnish and Estonian are quite }> close, so that Finns and Estonians can understand each other with }> care. Those two and Hungarian are further apart. }> } Yeah, many Estonian words are so easy understand what they mean, } like: "ravista" (shake) is in Estonian language: "loksutada". ... When I was a kid, one of my friends had Finnish grandparents nearby that we'd visit every once in a while, and another had Estonian parents living with him. Both of them picked up a smattering of the languages and shared it freely, and I was pleased to discover that all the dirty words were the same (Rey could confirm or refute that [say, ...]). I don't think the two of them ever met, though the one was in the audience when I and the other graduated from high school. Signaturerjv >} Graeme Thomas wrote: >... [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >of them ever met, though the one was in the audience when I and the other >graduated from high school. During the long years of the Cold War, the Estonians grew accustomed to watching television from Helsinki, and when they regained their independence they were already quite familiar with the trappings of a modern Western democracy. The Finns now visit Estonia frequently, and especially Tallinn, in droves, not least because the liquor is considerably cheaper than in Finland, as are the restaurants, making a nice day trip. The Finns apparently communicate quite easily with the Estonians. ************* DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen@cox.net) ************* * Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow * * My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps * >> Oleg Lego writes >>> The Lars Enderin entity posted thusly: >>>> I guess you meant Pauli's posting(s)? >>>> Finnish sentence structure is very different from English, [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Yeah, many Estonian words are so easy understand what they mean, > like: "ravista" (shake) is in Estonian language: "loksutada". Kaks kurata! SignatureSkitt (in Hayward, California) http://www.geocities.com/opus731/ > Oleg Lego skrev: >> The Lars Enderin entity posted thusly: [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > or Swedish, because Finnish belongs to a very different language > group. Yeah, we don't use any "rules" with sentences. I remember when I get a mail, where some man asks to me, is a Pauli Kesti man or woman name? (He have got a wife, Pauline Kerstin or something like that.) Now I understand, why Finnish language is very rare for many pc program install-menus, etc. Finnish language takes foreigners promblems, because we use letters 'a' and 'o' (a and o with two dots). SignatureWell... All comments are welcome too. > I was heared, that people who use their own name, so person who > use his own name, takes more serious(ly). "I was heared," = I heard (no comma) "that people who use their own name," = that people use their own/real name, "so person who use his own name," = and a person who uses his -/own/real name (no comma) "takes more serious(ly)." = is taken more seriously. (Corrections without warranty. All rights reversed.) Whether you use your real name or a nickname isn't the key here. People here in AUE seem to be quite liberal in that sense. If you want to be taken more seriously, there usually are two basic requirements: 1) You ought to find at least one sensible idea you want to introduce. 2) You should express your idea in a way that is understandable to others. No guarantees can be given, however, that you will be taken seriously even if you manage to overcome these two challenging obstacles. Furthermore, passing step two is difficult if you haven't passed step one yet. And, unfortunately, it isn't looking good in either of the two so far. Kesti Pauli (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message <453e2d08$0$1139$9b536df3@news.fv.fi>: > Someone wrote in Finnish: > Jos jatkat ryhmss "finet.ryhmat" edes yhden viestin [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Oh, I forgot, I can't write every time in English literally. ;-) There are quite a few English-speaking people here who can't write English properly. Ja minä? Puhun suomen kieltä vähän. SignatureWarning: keel away from child for hot bulb Interchange the alphabetic letter groups to reply > Kesti Pauli (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in > message <453e2d08$0$1139$9b536df3@news.fv.fi>: [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > There are quite a few English-speaking people here who can't write > English properly. Ja minä? Puhun suomen kieltä vähän. Where are you from? SignatureWell... All comments are welcome too. Kesti Pauli (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message <453f4926$0$1142$9b536df3@news.fv.fi>: >> Kesti Pauli (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in >> message <453e2d08$0$1139$9b536df3@news.fv.fi>: [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > Where are you from? Cardiff in South Wales. I have been to Finland once, staying at Vääksy near Asikkala, with trips to Järvenpää to see where Sibelius was born, and Ainola where he lived for most of his life. Yes, I'm a big Sibelius fan, and that's what made me something of a Finnophile. (Just noticed - where have all the ä's gone in my previous post?) SignatureWarning: keel away from child for hot bulb Interchange the alphabetic letter groups to reply Prai Jei skrev: > Kesti Pauli (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message > <453f4926$0$1142$9b536df3@news.fv.fi>: [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > (Just noticed - where have all the ä's gone in my previous post?) They seem to have been badly coded. The one above is ok. Btw: utf-8 is unnecessary and may be unreadable in many news readers. ISO-8859-1 serves well in Western Europe. > Kesti Pauli (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in > message <453f4926$0$1142$9b536df3@news.fv.fi>: [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > > (Just noticed - where have all the ä's gone in my previous post?) I see without any problems your ä-letters. What are you think, is Finnish language hard to learn? I think so, example: I lost my keys today Same in Finnish: "Tänään kadotin avaimeni." or: "Kadotin avaimeni tänään." or: "Avaimeni kadotin tänään." SignatureWell... All comments are welcome too. Kesti Pauli (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message <453fb340$0$1138$9b536df3@news.fv.fi>: >>> Where are you from? >> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > I see without any problems your ä-letters. What are you think, is > Finnish language hard to learn? The actual grammar of the language is straightforward. The case (partitive, inessive, &c) are no great problem and there are not really that many to learn. The big problem is learning what the actual words mean, since very few Finnish words look anything like their English (or French or German) equivalent. > I think so, example: I lost my keys today > > Same in Finnish: > > "Tänään kadotin avaimeni." or: "Kadotin avaimeni tänään." or: > "Avaimeni kadotin tänään." Interesting that the Finnish word for "key" is related to the word for "open", while the German equivalent Schlussel is related to the word for "close". Does that show a different mindset? SignatureWarning: keel away from child for hot bulb Interchange the alphabetic letter groups to reply > Interesting that the Finnish word for "key" is related to the word for > "open", while the German equivalent Schlussel is related to the word for > "close". Does that show a different mindset? Interesting observation, I've never thought of that before. I'm not sure what it tells about mindsets, but the Finnish word for "key", "avain", is literally a variant of the word "opener". In times it has got this specific meaning, while the other variant, "avaaja", means "opener" as in "pullonavaaja" (bottle opener) or "tölkinavaaja" (tin opener). I suppose a key is most strongly linked with unlocking in our minds, while with Germans it may be the opposite. No such relation with the English word "key", is there? Ilpo > > Interesting that the Finnish word for "key" is related to the word for > > "open", while the German equivalent Schlussel is related to the word for > > "close". Does that show a different mindset? > > Interesting observation, ..... > ..... No such relation with the English word "key", is there? It is interesting that in English there are several expressions using 'key', such as: ...the key to unlock your potential... ...the key to success is... ...the key-point is.. ...keynote speaker... ...key in the numbers... ...keyboard... ...key code... ...turnkey projects... ...key components... ...music key, Key of G... ...is totally keyed in... (I think, the word now starts to look weird)... ...key into the databank... Then there's turkey.... :-) SignatureSolo Thesailor http://sailingstoriesandtips.blogspot.com >>> Interesting that the Finnish word for "key" is related to the word >>> for "open", while the German equivalent Schlussel is related to the [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > Then there's turkey.... :-) Funny. ;-) I heard that word: "Drunk, drunked" contains really lots of synomyms. SignatureWell... All comments are welcome too. > It is interesting that in English there are several expressions using > 'key', such as: [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Then there's turkey.... :-) Many of those are quite universal, I believe. The ones least likely to exist in other languages probably are those where "key" is used as a verb or a verb derivative: to key in the numbers, totally keyed in. Other words that aren't related to the word "key" in other languages that I have some knowledge of are keynote, keyboard (I still haven't found the "any" key I'm supposed to press to continue!), and, yes, turkey (bird species such as turavain, turnyckel and Turschlüssel still remain to be discovered :-). Ilpo Ilpo (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message <1161934681.847619.83250@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: > Other words that aren't related to the word "key" in other languages > that I have some knowledge of are keynote, keyboard (I still haven't > found the "any" key I'm supposed to press to continue!) If the computer finds that there's no keyboard present at startup, it asks you to press the F1 key to continue. SignatureWarning: keel away from child for hot bulb Interchange the alphabetic letter groups to reply >Ilpo (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message ><1161934681.847619.83250@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>: [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >If the computer finds that there's no keyboard present at startup, it asks >you to press the F1 key to continue. Understanding that you, the human, master of all Creation, will know to plug in a keyboard first. Computers do not do well in understanding, do they? Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko Computerese Irregular Verb Conjugation: I have preferences. You have biases. He/She has prejudices. >> Interesting that the Finnish word for "key" is related to the word >> for "open", while the German equivalent Schlussel is related to the [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Ilpo Now I understand, what Prai Jei wrote. ;-) SignatureWell... All comments are welcome too. Kesti Pauli (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message <4540ce9d$2$1132$9b536df3@news.fv.fi>: > Now I understand, what Prai Jei wrote. ;-) I can be difficult to understand sometimes ;-)))) SignatureWarning: keel away from child for hot bulb Interchange the alphabetic letter groups to reply > .... > I can be difficult to understand sometimes ;-)))) Yes, definitely -and I thought it was just me. Why is that (that you can be difficult to understand sometimes, perhaps more so than the norm)? Please educate me: what does 'keel away from child for hot bulb' mean? And doesn't 'Interchange the alphabetic letter groups' apply both to the zyx-abc group and to the name field which also comprises alphabets? Thanks SignatureSolo Thesailor http://sailingstoriesandtips.blogspot.com The Solo Thesailor entity posted thusly: >> .... >> I can be difficult to understand sometimes ;-)))) [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >Please educate me: what does 'keel away from child for hot bulb' mean? Sound like an example of Japlish (Engrish?) -- Be careful of the mental parts when dissemble the yo yo. Oleg Lego (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message <3673k2dlab1rjqt70o9koqv51bhrvpa6ei@4ax.com>: > The Solo Thesailor entity posted thusly: > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >>can be difficult to understand sometimes, perhaps more so than the >>norm)? I'm rather technically minded with an IQ of 158, though I do my best to appear rather more normal. > And doesn't 'Interchange the alphabetic letter groups' apply both to > the zyx-abc group and to the name field which also comprises alphabets? Only these groups comprise consecutive letters of the alphabet, forwards and backwards. These are the groups to be interchanged. >>Please educate me: what does 'keel away from child for hot bulb' mean? > > Sound like an example of Japlish (Engrish?) That was a warning sticker on a mains-powered nightlight, clearly intended for a child's bedroom since the hot bulb in question would heat a glass bottle filled with water, setting up convection currents so that glittery bits within the water would set up a constantly changing sparkle when illuminated by said hot bulb. So it was a bit strange for the safety warning telling one to *keep* (as we presumed the first word should have been) it away from the child. > Be careful of the mental parts when dissemble the yo yo. Sounds like another one from the same supplier. SignatureWarning: keel away from child for hot bulb Interchange the alphabetic letter groups to reply > ... > > The Solo Thesailor entity posted thusly: [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > I'm rather technically minded with an IQ of ... > >>Please educate me: what does 'keel away from child for hot bulb' mean? > .... > So it was a bit strange for the safety warning telling one to *keep* (as we > presumed the first word should have been) it away from the child. Thanks for the explanation. I thought there was something quite deep about you. I like intelligent people although I don't go much by IQ. Some people seem to be jealous of them and are prejudiced against them; they in turn stifle their own development and expression (in order to fit in) or get kind of non-diligent. Sometimes some intelligent people seem to skip things in their communication and leave the listener to decipher; a lot of times the listener can't be expected to know the missing contents. Is 'keel away from child for hot bulb' commonly known and do you expect readers to understand what it means? Do you have it there just to amuse you or to make people curious? (I am curious.) Thanks :-) SignatureSolo Thesailor http://sailingstoriesandtips.blogspot.com >> ... >> > The Solo Thesailor entity posted thusly: [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >about you. I like intelligent people although I don't go much by IQ. >Some people seem to be jealous of them and are prejudiced against them; Yes. >they in turn stifle their own development and expression (in order to >fit in) or get kind of non-diligent. Sometimes some intelligent people Or ignore the twits. >seem to skip things in their communication and leave the listener to >decipher; a lot of times the listener can't be expected to know the >missing contents. Do you explain things that you consider to be obvious? 1) Sometimes, it has not even occurred to such people that what they said was not obvious. 2) Talking down to people is generally considered rude. >Is 'keel away from child for hot bulb' commonly known and do you expect >readers to understand what it means? Do you have it there just to amuse >you or to make people curious? (I am curious.) >Thanks :-) To a native speaker, it is an obvious error of the sort that a native speaker would NOT make. Someone who does not know English as well will not pick up on that nearly as fast, if he does at all. Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko Computerese Irregular Verb Conjugation: I have preferences. You have biases. He/She has prejudices. Gene Wirchenko (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message <h0jck2tb593li4mcohm7aeq5naidgajglo@4ax.com>: > Do you explain things that you consider to be obvious? 1) > Sometimes, it has not even occurred to such people that what they said > was not obvious. 2) Talking down to people is generally considered > rude. Many a time in work I have to take customers through a problem that has come up on the computer. Sometimes that means typing in weird, incomprehensible commands into the computer, and I try my best to put a "human face" on these instructions by explaining to the customers what they are supposed to achieve. Thus the DOS commands ren stock.mdb stock.bad copy z:\backup\stock.mdb would be explained as something like "we need to keep the damaged stock file there for reference, but with a name that shows that it is damaged, and then we copy in the good one from the other machine via the network." This is something I like to think I do rather well. Our customers tend not to be too familiar with computers except when they are running the application programs. If anything goes wrong and they have to drop out of the application back to the operating system they're lost. So however simplistic the instructions, there's no chance of "talking down". > To a native speaker, it is an obvious error of the sort that a > native speaker would NOT make. Someone who does not know English as > well will not pick up on that nearly as fast, if he does at all. Some previous sig lines that I've used have been logical errors, or wrong words used which are one letter different to the correct ones. Try these: "Pair them off into threes" (me as a child) "Where's the entrance out?" (asked by my mother) "Two-colour printing (red/black/blue/green) available" (printer manual) (What that last one turned out to mean was that ink cartridges for this printer were available in the four colours named, but only two cartridges could be fitted into the printer at any one time.) Speaking of language errors, would it look silly to a Finn to represent the number 158 as viisitoistakymmentä kahdeksan? SignatureWarning: keel away from child for hot bulb Interchange the alphabetic letter groups to reply >Gene Wirchenko (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message ><h0jck2tb593li4mcohm7aeq5naidgajglo@4ax.com>: [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >> was not obvious. 2) Talking down to people is generally considered >> rude. >Many a time in work I have to take customers through a problem that has come >up on the computer. Sometimes that means typing in weird, incomprehensible [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >then we copy in the good one from the other machine via the network." This >is something I like to think I do rather well. I would not bother with the level of detail. Explaining my every action is a great way to slow things down. If asked, I would reply something like yours, but would add that the person really does not need to know this, that it is part of the details of why he called me rather than did it himself. >Our customers tend not to be too familiar with computers except when they >are running the application programs. If anything goes wrong and they have >to drop out of the application back to the operating system they're lost. >So however simplistic the instructions, there's no chance of "talking >down". Ha! I once spoke with a client who asked for an explanation. Even a basic explanation was beyond him. I simplified about three times until he finally seemed to get it. He called my boss and complained that I had talked down to him. [snip] Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko Computerese Irregular Verb Conjugation: I have preferences. You have biases. He/She has prejudices. Prai Jei filted: >Some previous sig lines that I've used have been logical errors, or wrong >words used which are one letter different to the correct ones. Try these: > "Pair them off into threes" (me as a child) You are, it would seem, Florida State football coach Bill Peterson, reported to have told his players "you guys pair up in groups of three, then line up in a circle"...he's also supposed to have asked them to line up "alphabetically by height"....r Signature"Keep your eye on the Bishop. I want to know when he makes his move", said the Inspector, obliquely. The R H Draney entity posted thusly: >Prai Jei filted: >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >circle"...he's also supposed to have asked them to line up "alphabetically by >height"....r At least two of those make sense to me. A line need not be straight, and alphabetically by height could easily mean that two or more Smiths should arrange themselves by height. >The R H Draney entity posted thusly: > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > >At least two of those make sense to me. A line need not be straight, Well, yes. However, when people are instructed to "line up" or "form a line" a straight line is intended. After all, if people are standing around in random positions it is possible to draw a line passing through each person once. It would, of course, be a wiggly line, and there many different routes the line could follow. >and alphabetically by height could easily mean that two or more Smiths >should arrange themselves by height. SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) >Prai Jei filted: >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >circle"...he's also supposed to have asked them to line up "alphabetically by >height"....r That last one is easy-peasy: five feet five foot eight five foot eleven five foot five five foot four five foot nine five foot one five foot seven five foot six five foot ten five foot three five foot two seven feet seven foot one seven foot two six feet six foot eight six foot eleven six foot five six foot four six foot nine six foot one six foot seven six foot six six foot ten six foot three six foot two Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko Computerese Irregular Verb Conjugation: I have preferences. You have biases. He/She has prejudices. Gene Wirchenko filted: >>he's also supposed to have asked them to line up "alphabetically by >>height"....r [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > six foot three > six foot two That works until some smartass tries to use the metric system....r Signature"Keep your eye on the Bishop. I want to know when he makes his move", said the Inspector, obliquely. > --- > >they in turn stifle their own development and expression (in order to [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > was not obvious. 2) Talking down to people is generally considered > rude. Yes, when I communicate I think about the listener and what may or may not be obvious _to them_. With mixed audience it is a balancing act. In seminars one can see the feedback instantly or one can ask the audience, in newsgroups one can put some things in brackets. That, I don't consider rude and I don't classify it as talking down. I think calling people 'twits' is rude, though. > >Is 'keel away from child for hot bulb' commonly known and do you expect > >readers to understand what it means? Do you have it there just to amuse [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > native speaker would NOT make. Someone who does not know English as > well will not pick up on that nearly as fast, if he does at all. Some people who are intelligent in one field, particularly a narrow field of their own, are not intelligent in other fields such as social intelligence. They can also get into the habit of thinking fast (in one field, therefore use the same speed in areas they're not as intelligent in). In the above example, where I wrote also for the wider audience, you may have missed the point of the questions. It was very obvious to me, and I'm sure to most readers, that 'keel away from child....etc..' was weird. The question was about what it all meant and the origin of the sentence, which Prai Jei explained quite clearly upthread and subsequently downthread. He did not come across as superior. His communication intelligence is apparent. Thanks for your input. SignatureSolo Thesailor http://sailingstoriesandtips.blogspot.com Solo Thesailor (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message <1162210945.592132.120810@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>: > Thanks for the explanation. I thought there was something quite deep > about you. Appreciation at last :) > I like intelligent people although I don't go much by IQ. As I have pointed out elsewhere, all it measures is how well they can do intelligence tests. > Some people seem to be jealous of them and are prejudiced against them; I've had that since childhood, as they warned me about even then. > Is 'keel away from child for hot bulb' commonly known and do you expect > readers to understand what it means? Do you have it there just to amuse > you or to make people curious? (I am curious.) > Thanks :-) Both - it's an interesting-conversation generator - as has happened here :) Most readers would recognise it as typical garbled English although those particular words would not be well known. SignatureWarning: keel away from child for hot bulb Interchange the alphabetic letter groups to reply > > Interesting that the Finnish word for "key" is related to the word for > > "open", while the German equivalent Schlussel is related to the word for [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > minds, while with Germans it may be the opposite. No such relation with > the English word "key", is there? Well, yes, "church key" is a long-established nickname for a bottle-opener or can opener. Discussion and photo hunts here have shown the similarity in shape between a large traditional key to a church door and the early shape of bottle-openers.... Mike didn't put those pix in the AUE Website, it appears, but they are somewhere to be found. SignatureBest wishes -- Donna Richoux >> > Interesting that the Finnish word for "key" is related to the word for >> > "open", while the German equivalent Schlussel is related to the word for [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >and the early shape of bottle-openers.... Mike didn't put those pix in >the AUE Website, it appears, but they are somewhere to be found. Short of using a screwdriver driven in by the palm of the hand, then twisting it, one was essential for opening a can of beer before pop top cans were invented. SignatureCharles Riggs >>Well, yes, "church key" is a long-established nickname for a >>bottle-opener or can opener. Discussion and photo hunts here have shown [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >twisting it, one was essential for opening a can of beer before pop >top cans were invented. And is still handy for such rtasks as punching pouring holes in the top of canned fruit and evaporated milk cans. I see at one of the online dictionaries that "church key" goes back to the 1950s, the decade in which I first began drinking beer, and I recall some sort of joke going around about someone trying to sneak a can of beer when he is confronted by his church's deacon as to what he is up to. He tells the deacon the object in his hand is the church key. ************* DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen@cox.net) ************* * Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow * * My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps * > Kesti Pauli (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in > message <453fb340$0$1138$9b536df3@news.fv.fi>: [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > "open", while the German equivalent Schlussel is related to the word > for "close". Does that show a different mindset? Key: cabin's keycard, door key, warehouse key. And I think that place, where key can be use, comes first in English language? SignatureWell... All comments are welcome too. As we all stood and listened, Kesti Pauli sung the following words: > > Kesti Pauli (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in > > message <453fb340$0$1138$9b536df3@news.fv.fi>: [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Key: cabin's keycard, door key, warehouse key. And I think that > place, where key can be use, comes first in English language? Yes. It's a general rule, related to the fact that in English an adjective usually comes before a noun, and not after it. A bookshelf is a shelf for books. A car key is a key for a car. A blue door is a door that is blue. There are many (?) exceptions, of course. By the way, you appear to have difficulty with the word "the". Perhaps Finnish does not have a "definite article"? SignatureA. Gwilliam To e-mail me, replace "bottomless_pit" with "devnull" >As we all stood and listened, Kesti Pauli sung the following words: > [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] >By the way, you appear to have difficulty with the word "the". Perhaps >Finnish does not have a "definite article"? Finnish as neither definite nor indefinite articles. ************* DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen@cox.net) ************* * Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow * * My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps * |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2012 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.