You can hear them thinking

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Marius Hancu - 31 Oct 2006 19:20 GMT

Hello:

------
[Billy talks about the henchmen/bodyguards serving the Chairman,
Mr. Hines, a New York politician]

I recognized them as of the same ilk I had been living among for some
months, the kind you can hear thinking.

E.L. Doctorow, Billy Bathgate, p. 272
------

I wonder if "you can hear them thinking" because they are dumb, and
perhaps forced to talk audibly under their breath?

Is this an idiom?

Thank you.
Marius Hancu

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Skitt - 31 Oct 2006 19:33 GMT

> ------
> [Billy talks about the henchmen/bodyguards serving the Chairman,
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>
> Is this an idiom?

Perhaps the gears in their heads start grinding when they think.

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Skitt (in Hayward, California)
http://www.geocities.com/opus731/

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Jeffrey Turner - 31 Oct 2006 23:10 GMT

>> ------
>> [Billy talks about the henchmen/bodyguards serving the Chairman,
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>
> Perhaps the gears in their heads start grinding when they think.

That's what I'd think. A related expression would be, "I know you're
thinking, I can see the wood smoke."

--Jeff

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Not ignorance, but ignorance of ignorance,
is the death of knowledge.
-Alfred North Whitehead

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Tony Cooper - 31 Oct 2006 19:38 GMT

>Hello:
>
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>I wonder if "you can hear them thinking" because they are dumb, and
>perhaps forced to talk audibly under their breath?

It's an interesting observation. I can picture what he's talking
about because there are some people who are so transparent that you
can imagine what their thought processes are. I think I'd describe it
as "the kind you can see what they're thinking", though. The only
hearing involved is the little voice in your own mind.

>Is this an idiom?

Idiom as in "commonly used"? No. Idiom as in "an expression whose
meaning does not follow from the meaning of the individual words of
which it is composed"? Yes.

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Tony Cooper
Orlando, FL

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jerry_friedman@yahoo.com - 31 Oct 2006 20:00 GMT

> >Hello:
> >
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
> as "the kind you can see what they're thinking", though. The only
> hearing involved is the little voice in your own mind.

If I remember the context correctly, it's more like you're aware
they're constantly thinking, constantly using trained judgement to look
for dangers. (But I might not remember the context correctly.)

You've reminded me of this book, so I've looked at some of your other
questions and felt more context would have been helpful. For instance,
in "They are niching me", it's not even clear that "They" are the
police. They might be his former employees who are abandoning him. It
doesn't help me understand "niching", though.

> >Is this an idiom?
>
> Idiom as in "commonly used"? No.

I agree.

> Idiom as in "an expression whose
> meaning does not follow from the meaning of the individual words of
> which it is composed"? Yes.

I think your second definition is better known as "figure of speech".

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Jerry Friedman

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Marius Hancu - 31 Oct 2006 20:42 GMT

> You've reminded me of this book, so I've looked at some of your other
> questions and felt more context would have been helpful. For instance,
> in "They are niching me", it's not even clear that "They" are the
> police.

I was equally confused:-)

Marius Hancu

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Marius Hancu - 31 Oct 2006 21:18 GMT

I saw the movie, but didn't know things were this close to reality:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_Schultz

Marius Hancu

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Eric Schwartz - 01 Nov 2006 19:49 GMT

> I saw the movie, but didn't know things were this close to reality:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_Schultz

I was struck by how much he looked like Tim Roth in "Hoodlum". Or
vice-versa, I suppose.

-=Eric

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Maria - 31 Oct 2006 19:51 GMT

> Hello:
>
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>
> Is this an idiom?

Yes -- to me, anyway.

It means that one knows, or senses, what someone else is thinking. It
does not involve hearing anything.

(I haven't read the _Billy Bathgate_, though. Doctorow is not a favorite
of mine.)

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Maria

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Solo Thesailor - 01 Nov 2006 00:40 GMT

> > ------
> > I wonder if "you can hear them thinking" because they are dumb, and
> > perhaps forced to talk audibly under their breath?
> -----
> It means that one knows, or senses, what someone else is thinking. It
> does not involve hearing anything.

Yes, an example of metaphors. Apparently,
the 'Auditory' person says "(could) hear them thinking" or "hear the
grinding (of cogwheels),
the 'Visual' person (me, and perhaps Tony Cooper upthread?) says
"picture/see what they're thinking" or "see it (written) all over their
faces",
the 'Kinesthetic' person says "feel them thinking" or "feel the room
shake with their thinking".

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Solo Thesailor
http://sailingstoriesandtips.blogspot.com

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Arcadian Rises - 01 Nov 2006 00:09 GMT

> Hello:
>
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> I wonder if "you can hear them thinking" because they are dumb, and
> perhaps forced to talk audibly under their breath?

It's thinking aloud, which (IMO of course) is more tactless, or naive,
than dumb.
Some artless, honest people share with you their thoughts as they pop
into their mind. Of course, in some (many!) circumstances it would be
dumb to share your unsolicited opinion and immediate feelings as you
experience them.

Now, moving your lips when you read, or even reading aloud for your own
only benefit, it's a different story.

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Discussion Groups / English Usage / November 2006

You can hear them thinking