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Discussion Groups / English Usage / November 2006barrel stuffed to the coops
Hello: What are the "coops" here? What I have in the M-W unabridged doesn't quite resonate. I am quite sure the sentence means "completely full," but ... ---- [Billy finds part of the money stashed away by Dutch Schultz] ... un unbunged barrel stuffed to the coops with the currency of the United States ... E. L. Doctorow, Billy Bathgate, p. 319 ----- Thank you. Marius Hancu > [Billy finds part of the money stashed away by Dutch Schultz] > > ... un unbunged barrel stuffed to the coops with the currency of the > United States ... > > E. L. Doctorow, Billy Bathgate, p. 319 Coops may in this sentence be a misprint for hoops. The component parts of a wooden barrel are: 1. Shaped wood staves for the body. 2. Circular barrel ends, top and bottom. 3. Hoops = rings of metal, which hold together at each end all the staves. I.e. a barrel of money, full right to the top, might be described as stuffed to the hoop: but this is not a standard or common phrase, and nor is stuffed to the coop(s). Billy Bathgate appeared in 1989 when New York publishers had already abandoned traditional methods of proofreading.  SignatureDon Phillipson Carlsbad Springs (Ottawa, Canada) > Coops may in this sentence be a misprint > for hoops. The component parts of a [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > 3. Hoops = rings of metal, which hold > together at each end all the staves. Thanks for educating me in the intricacies of it all:-) Marius Hancu > Hello: > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > E. L. Doctorow, Billy Bathgate, p. 319 > ----- None of the historical dictionaries show that "coops" ever signified any piece of a barrel -- the origin of "cooper" and "chicken coop" is the entirety of the container, related to "cup". However, *hoops* are the ring-pieces that hold a barrel together, and I suspect that Mr. Doctorow or his publishers got the word wrong. SignatureBest -- Donna Richoux > > ... un unbunged barrel stuffed to the coops with the currency of the > > United States ... [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > ring-pieces that hold a barrel together, and I suspect that Mr. Doctorow > or his publishers got the word wrong. That might be well the case. Thanks. Marius Hancu > That might be well the case. > Thanks. > Marius Hancu "That might well be the case." SignatureRay UK Donna Richoux filted: >> ... un unbunged barrel stuffed to the coops with the currency of the >> United States ... [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >ring-pieces that hold a barrel together, and I suspect that Mr. Doctorow >or his publishers got the word wrong. Shame he didn't have the nerve to go for the pun: "a barrel stuffed to the gills"....r Signature"Keep your eye on the Bishop. I want to know when he makes his move", said the Inspector, obliquely. > Hello: > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > E. L. Doctorow, Billy Bathgate, p. 319 From what you are posting it seems Doctorow has a different version of American English than everybody else. > What are the "coops" here? Probably the hoops. A maker of barrels is called a cooper, which is a derivative of hooper-- in order to make barrels, one must make hoops. Gerry > What are the "coops" here? > What I have in the M-W unabridged doesn't quite resonate. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > E. L. Doctorow, Billy Bathgate, p. 319 "Coops" = barrel "hoops" has been mentioned, but "stuffed to the hoops" is not a familiar phrase. I'm thinking it should read "stuffed to the top" but doesn't because of poor proofreading or a comedy of errors when making a correction. And what is an "unbunged barrel?" Anyone? SignatureMaria Maria <marian.c-b@sbcglobal.net> had it: > > What are the "coops" here? > > What I have in the M-W unabridged doesn't quite resonate. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > And what is an "unbunged barrel?" Anyone? The bung in a barrel is the cork or other stopper which is fitted into any of the holes. Beer barrels have two holes - one for the tap through which the beer will emerge and another to allow air to enter via a porous bung which is knocked into the centre of the air-tight bung which is there during transport. I know about beer barrels, having delivered them for Davenports (Beer At Home) and also worked in pubs when I was a student. Unbunged could mean either that the bungs haven't been fitted yet, or that they have been removed. I can't see why either of these is relevant in the above though. SignatureDavid ===== > > What are the "coops" here? > > What I have in the M-W unabridged doesn't quite resonate. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > And what is an "unbunged barrel?" Anyone? That's a really good question. A bunghole of a barrel is a small hole or tap in the side, to get at the fluid contents. To bung the hole is to plug it, so to unbung it should mean to unplug it. But that seems to be have no bearing on having a barrel stuffed with money. I bet Doctorow thought it meant to have the lid pried off. I never read anything by Doctorow -- does he get any academic respect? I thought his stuff sells with the mass-market books. SignatureBest -- Donna Richoux >> > What are the "coops" here? >> > What I have in the M-W unabridged doesn't quite resonate. [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] >have no bearing on having a barrel stuffed with money. I bet Doctorow >thought it meant to have the lid pried off. If the idea was to hide the money in the barrel it might have made sense to have kept the barrel intact and to have inserted the money through the bunghole. SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) > I never read anything by Doctorow -- does he get any academic respect? I > thought his stuff sells with the mass-market books. Not sure about academics ... You may want to see the awards here: [url]http://dictionary.cambridge.org/define.asp?key=26550&dict=CALD[/url] Marius Hancu > > I never read anything by Doctorow -- does he get any academic respect? I > > thought his stuff sells with the mass-market books. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > You may want to see the awards here: > [url]http://dictionary.cambridge.org/define.asp?key=26550&dict=CALD[/url] I don't think that's the link you wanted. This is from Wikipedia (skipping summaries and the books that weren't nominated for anything): (1971) The Book of Daniel. Nominated for a National Book Award, (1975) Ragtime. Received the National Book Critics Circle Award and the Arts and Letters Award (1985) World's Fair. Received the 1986 National Book Award. (1989) Billy Bathgate. Nominated for the Pulitzer and won the PEN/Faulkner award. (2005) The March. Awarded the National Book Critics' Circle Award I think of him in a category that also includes William Styron (who I haven't read) and Joyce Carol Oates--authors of books that win awards and become best-sellers. People have been saying and hinting here that his writing doesn't seem good, but you really can't tell from the few examples that throw Marius. SignatureJerry Friedman |
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