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Discussion Groups / English Usage / November 2006Strange use of 'stranded'?
BBC Radio News. 'he was left stranded when his yacht capsized 1000 miles out to sea'. Surely 'stranded' is the very last thing he could be in that situation? > BBC Radio News. 'he was left stranded when his yacht > capsized 1000 miles out to sea'. Surely 'stranded' is > the very last thing he could be in that situation? From the _New Shorter Oxford_: stranded 1 That has been driven or washed ashore; that has run or been left aground. E18. 2 fig. Abandoned in an isolated or inaccessible position; left (behind) in difficulties, esp. by the withdrawal or failure of a means of access or transport. M19. Your point is valid if you take only the first definition. Note, though, that the second definition carries no implication that the stranding has taken place on land. The boat that capsized certainly represented a "failure of a means of ... transport", and the yachtsman was certainly "left in difficulties". > > BBC Radio News. 'he was left stranded when his yacht > > capsized 1000 miles out to sea'. Surely 'stranded' is [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > means of ... transport", and the yachtsman was certainly > "left in difficulties". The key item in this OED entry is FIG = figurative, i.e. use #2 of Stranded is a metaphor. The primary word remains the noun Strand = seashore. But we still say someone alone and ticketless in (say) St. Louis is "stranded:" i.e. the metaphor is current. The identical point was debated a couple of years ago when a Canadian submarine was burned out and adrift at sea 1000 km. from land. Early broadcasts suggested it was "stranded." Broadcasters later agreed it was a bit silly to use a marine term with a specific meaning to describe metaphorically a marine disaster lacking that specific aspect.  SignatureDon Phillipson Carlsbad Springs (Ottawa, Canada) > > > BBC Radio News. 'he was left stranded when his yacht > > > capsized 1000 miles out to sea'. Surely 'stranded' is > > > the very last thing he could be in that situation? > > From the _New Shorter Oxford_: > > stranded > > 1 That has been driven or washed ashore; that has > > run or been left aground. E18. > > 2 fig. Abandoned in an isolated or inaccessible > > position; left (behind) in difficulties, esp. by > > the withdrawal or failure of a means of access or > > transport. M19. > > Your point is valid if you take only the first definition. > > Note, though, that the second definition carries no > > implication that the stranding has taken place on land. The > > boat that capsized certainly represented a "failure of a > > means of ... transport", and the yachtsman was certainly > > "left in difficulties". > The key item in this OED entry is FIG = figurative, Assuming by "OED" you mean the _Oxford English Dictionary_ (_OED_), I didn't refer to that dictionary. I referred to the _New Shorter Oxford English Dictionary_ (_NSOED_). _OED_ does not in fact call the later meaning of "stranded" simply figurative. It tags it "transf. and fig.", where "transf." means (from the table of abbreviations) transf. - transferred sense > i.e. use #2 of Stranded is a metaphor. The primary word > remains the noun Strand = seashore. But we still say > someone alone and ticketless in (say) St. Louis is > "stranded:" i.e. the metaphor is current. The language has lots of words that were originally metaphors, but have been used with the metaphorical meaning so much that we don't think of them as metaphors anymore. I think that is the situation with "stranded". It has been used so much with its later meaning that a lot of people would be unaware that it ever referred to a boat being beached. I don't think that I, for one, would readily think of that meaning, although I would recall it when reminded. One _OED_ quotation is 1901 Scotsman 5 Nov. 6/8 The fog lifted a little and the immense array of stranded omnibuses and vans would be able to find their way home. To me, that's a natural use of "stranded", and it would never occur to me that the omnibuses and vans were being said to have run aground. _Merriam-Webster's 11th Collegiate_ defines "strand" with its modern use without saying "figurative" or any other special tag. They simply say Main Entry: 2 strand Function:verb Date:1621 transitive verb 1 : to run, drive, or cause to drift onto a strand : run aground 2 : to leave in a strange or an unfavorable place especially without funds or means to depart 3 : to leave (a base runner) on base at the end of an inning in baseball In Merriam-Webster dictionaries, definitions are in chronological order, so the "run aground" use is older than the others. > The identical point was debated a couple of years ago when > a Canadian submarine was burned out and adrift at sea > 1000 km. from land. Early broadcasts suggested it was > "stranded." Broadcasters later agreed it was a bit silly > to use a marine term with a specific meaning to describe > metaphorically a marine disaster lacking that specific aspect. I can see where it could conceivably be reasonable to object to the use of "stranded" in the modern sense when it deals with a nautical vessel that's in trouble, but that objection shouldn't carry over to cases that have nothing to do with nautical vessels. Anyway, I don't agree with the objection. > BBC Radio News. 'he was left stranded when his yacht capsized 1000 miles > out to sea'. Surely 'stranded' is the very last thing he could be in > that situation? You'd think so, wouldn't you? >BBC Radio News. 'he was left stranded when his yacht capsized 1000 miles >out to sea'. Surely 'stranded' is the very last thing he could be in >that situation? Only if you use a very old definition of the word "strand" when it meant beach or shore (stranding = beaching). But contemporary usage includes the concept of merely being up the creek without a way to get home. Jitze > >BBC Radio News. 'he was left stranded when his yacht capsized 1000 miles > >out to sea'. Surely 'stranded' is the very last thing he could be in [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > usage includes the concept of merely being up the creek without > a way to get home. Yes, but extended and metaphorical usage is questionable when it's used in the context where it originated, especially if, like "strand", it's still commonly used in its basic meaning. It's OK to say an athlete "ran out of gas", but when you say it of a car, it can only be taken literally. This is a less extreme case, but it still causes a hiccup and shouts "Lazy!" These people are _paid_ to write. I've got an upside-down light switch here: it causes no real inconvenience, and I've never bothered to change it, but the electrician should still be ashamed of himself. SignatureMike. >I've got an upside-down light switch here: it causes no real >inconvenience, and I've never bothered to change it, but the >electrician should still be ashamed of himself. Was it a DIY job? SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) >>I've got an upside-down light switch here: it causes no real >>inconvenience, and I've never bothered to change it, but the >>electrician should still be ashamed of himself. > > Was it a DIY job? That's a bit unkind! We had friends who moved into a house previously owned by a dentist who had made several embellishments to the property and had been proud of his DIY skills. They were surprised to find on moving in that that the doors of a built-in bedroom wardrobe, which the previous owner had installed himself, could only be fastened from the inside. SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) >>>I've got an upside-down light switch here: it causes no real >>>inconvenience, and I've never bothered to change it, but the [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >doors of a built-in bedroom wardrobe, which the previous owner had >installed himself, could only be fastened from the inside. A dentist is accustomed to being outside and fitting things inside. I wonder whether he used a mirror to see what he was doing when fitting the fasteners? SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) LFS filted: >We had friends who moved into a house previously owned by a dentist who >had made several embellishments to the property and had been proud of >his DIY skills. They were surprised to find on moving in that that the >doors of a built-in bedroom wardrobe, which the previous owner had >installed himself, could only be fastened from the inside. Not the default configuration, to be sure, but I can think of a couple of reasons you'd want something like that.... Previous owner of *my* place put silver foil wallpaper in two of the bathrooms, and mirror tiles on the ceiling of one of the same...I can understand what she was going for ("reflective surfaces make a small space seem larger") but it didn't really work in this context, because unlike the desired state of affairs when one is on the toilet, there wasn't room for reflection....r Signature"Keep your eye on the Bishop. I want to know when he makes his move", said the Inspector, obliquely. >>> I've got an upside-down light switch here: it causes no real >>> inconvenience, and I've never bothered to change it, but the [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > previous owner had installed himself, could only be fastened from the > inside. We all have our funny little ways. That's more the sort of post I'd expect from your furniture specialist sister DFS SignatureJohn Dean Oxford >>>>I've got an upside-down light switch here: it causes no real >>>>inconvenience, and I've never bothered to change it, but the [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > We all have our funny little ways. That's more the sort of post I'd expect > from your furniture specialist sister DFS <giggle> Think sofas, think Gorey... SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) >I've got an upside-down light switch here: it causes no real >inconvenience, and I've never bothered to change it, but the >electrician should still be ashamed of himself. Hang on a mo'. He may have been a very sensitive and caring electrician, catering to an otherpondian former resident. Upside-down switches are in the eye of the beholder, and "correct" orientation is a function of which side of the pond one dwells on. Having lived in Leftpondia now for nigh on 35 years, I have become utterly confused as to which is which. This is not normaly a problem, but used to cause me considerable grief when I used to have to set up something called "the deadstart panel" [1] in a super computer - essentially setting 256 switches just right in order to get the beast going. Invariably I would suffer a brain freeze half-way through the process and have to do a mental double-check whether I was dealing with an American or a British computer - and thus which way was "on" and which way was "off". [1] Picture at <http://pages.sbcglobal.net/couperusj/Deadstart.htm> Jitze > >I've got an upside-down light switch here: it causes no real > >inconvenience, and I've never bothered to change it, but the > >electrician should still be ashamed of himself. > > Hang on a mo'. He may have been a very sensitive and caring > electrician, catering to an otherpondian former resident. It's a two-gang switch: one light is on its left, and the other on its right. An elsepondian would have ended up just as confused in his own way. (I once stayed at a Tibetan Buddhist center in Scotland, in which a number of the hot taps were marked "cold", and v-v. The plumbing had been done by a volunteer, who, they told me, had done it on purpose "as an exercise in mindfulness". I call such people cheeky sods, who will very likely be reincarnated as slugs.) > Upside-down switches are in the eye of the beholder, and "correct" > orientation is a function of which side of the pond one dwells [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > [1] Picture at <http://pages.sbcglobal.net/couperusj/Deadstart.htm> I think I'd have taken the easy way out and simply gone mad. SignatureMike. Jitze Couperus <couperus-eschew-this@znet.com> had it: > Upside-down switches are in the eye of the beholder, and "correct" > orientation is a function of which side of the pond one dwells [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > or a British computer - and thus which way was "on" and which > way was "off". There's a curving section of motorway where the M40 joins the M5 northbound which has two lanes but where you can't see the other carriageway. I am usually perfectly OK with code switching between France and England, but here I occasionally have a mild panic at 70 mph as I can't quite remember which of the two lanes is the near side. SignatureDavid ===== Derek Turner: >>> BBC Radio News. 'he was left stranded when his yacht capsized 1000 miles >>> out to sea'. Surely 'stranded' is the very last thing he could be in >>> that situation? Jitze Couperus: >> Only if you use a very old definition of the word "strand" when it >> meant beach or shore (stranding = beaching). But contemporary >> usage includes the concept of merely being up the creek without >> a way to get home. Mike Lyle: > Yes, but extended and metaphorical usage is questionable when it's used > in the context where it originated... Only if the original meaning is still used, and it isn't. This is a dead metaphor, and I object to this objection to the BBC's wording. > especially if, like "strand", it's still commonly used in its basic meaning. No it isn't. Some foreign places may have "strand" as a noun, but whoever heard of it as a verb with that meaning? SignatureMark Brader, Toronto | I still remember the first time his reality check msb@vex.net | bounced. -- Darlene Richards On 28 Nov 2006, Mark Brader wrote > Derek Turner: >> especially if, like "strand", it's still commonly used in its >> basic meaning. > > No it isn't. Some foreign places may have "strand" as a noun, "Foreign" as in "England"? (It may not be in wide current usage, but my gut reaction is that the noun is entirely understood -- dormant vocabulary.) > but whoever heard of it as a verb with that meaning? [waves hand] SignatureCheers, Harvey Canadian and British English, indiscriminately mixed For e-mail, change harvey.news to harvey.van > On 28 Nov 2006, Mark Brader wrote > > Derek Turner: [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > [waves hand] I shall be gob-smacked* if there's anywhere in the English-speaking world, no matter how far from the sea, where the expressions "stranded whale", "stranded dolphin", etc aren't entirely current. Similarly "strand-line" and productive relatives, all based on the verb in its literal sense. I'd say Mark needs to spend more time in boats. *OK, not for the first time in AUE. SignatureMike. On 28 Nov 2006, Mike Lyle wrote >> On 28 Nov 2006, Mark Brader wrote >>> Derek Turner: [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > the expressions "stranded whale", "stranded dolphin", etc aren't > entirely current. Indeed -- and getting back to the OP's question, if someone spoke of a "stranded whale" which was stuck somewhere out in the Channel, I'd think "huh?" SignatureCheers, Harvey Canadian and British English, indiscriminately mixed For e-mail, change harvey.news to harvey.van >On 28 Nov 2006, Mike Lyle wrote > [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] >a "stranded whale" which was stuck somewhere out in the Channel, I'd >think "huh?" I would accept "stranded in the middle of nowhere" as a perfectly acceptable phrase even though the nowhere was nowhere near a beach. SignatureTony Cooper Orlando, FL On 28 Nov 2006, Tony Cooper wrote >> Indeed -- and getting back to the OP's question, if someone >> spoke of a "stranded whale" which was stuck somewhere out in [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > perfectly acceptable phrase even though the nowhere was nowhere > near a beach. Fair 'nuff -- but can "the middle of nowhere" be in the middle of a boundless stretch of water, or must it be land-based? (It'd have to be land-based, for me, and it's the lack of land that's the problem with the original use.) SignatureCheers, Harvey Canadian and British English, indiscriminately mixed For e-mail, change harvey.news to harvey.van > On 28 Nov 2006, Tony Cooper wrote > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > (It'd have to be land-based, for me, and it's the lack of land that's > the problem with the original use.) Prezackly. That's why I said earlier that while it's OK to say an athlete "ran out of gas", it would be clearly ludicrous to say a car "ran out of gas" unless you really did mean it didn't have any carburant left. Moving on a bit, it's also why I find it offensive when a newspaper on different pages reports a gunfight in Baghdad and "a fight to the death" between two football teams. SignatureMike. > On 28 Nov 2006, Tony Cooper wrote >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Fair 'nuff -- but can "the middle of nowhere" be in the middle of a > boundless stretch of water, or must it be land-based? I'd say the latter. "Stranded" doesn't require that you be *by* the water (doesn't require a strand), but it does imply a degree of conceptual stationariness that being lost or adrift at sea doesn't provide. SignatureSalvatore Volatile > I would accept "stranded in the middle of nowhere" as a perfectly > acceptable phrase even though the nowhere was nowhere near a beach. It seems fine to me so long as it is clear that it is a metaphor. As soon as boats and ocean come into it, it becomes confusing. When your car breaks down near Timbuktu, it's fine to say you're "stranded in the middle of nowhere"; if your yacht capsizes somewhere in the South Pacific, however, the same phrase conjures up images of reefs and beaches. SignatureRob Bannister [...] > I shall be gob-smacked* if there's anywhere in the > English-speaking world, no matter how far from the sea, where [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > *OK, not for the first time in AUE. I can't say with assurance that I've never read of a "stranded" whale, say, but I would be far more likely to read of a "beached" whale here ITGOUSofA. "Strand-line" is a brand spanking new term to me, though I can guess its meaning. I expect Sal, who's intimately familiar with the ocean, would use the term in his daily conversations, while I, as a product of the Great Lakes Desert, wouldn't have had any reason to learn of such things. I do note that my RHUD shows no definition for the *noun* "strand" that pertains in any way to sand, water, boats or related items -- just fibers, strings, ropes and such. It could be that the US is not part of the English-speaking world, though. Signaturerzed [...] > I do note that my RHUD shows no definition for the *noun* > "strand" that pertains in any way to sand, water, boats or related > items -- just fibers, strings, ropes and such. It could be that > the US is not part of the English-speaking world, though. I'm not sure what your "RHUD" stands for, but my _Random House Dictionary of the English Language Second Edition Unabridged_ has strand [...] 5 n. the land bordering the sea, a lake, or a river; shore; beach. That would be easy to overlook because it's the fifth meaning in an entry that's headed by "strand v.t.". > [...] > [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > meaning in an entry that's headed by "strand v.t.". > You're quite right. I did overlook it. I apologize for the FUD from my misreading the RHUD (which is the CD version of what they call the "Random House Webster's Unabridged Dictionary, version 3.0). Signaturerzed Mark Brader: > > No it isn't. Some foreign places may have "strand" as a noun, Harvey Van Sickle: > "Foreign" as in "England"? Of course! > > but whoever heard of it as a verb with that meaning? > > [waves hand] There, see what I mean? Nobody at all! SignatureMark Brader | "Some societies define themselves by being open to new Toronto | influences, others define their identity by resisting. msb@vex.net | In either case, they take the consequences." >Mark Brader: >> > No it isn't. Some foreign places may have "strand" as a noun, [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >There, see what I mean? Nobody at all! You want us all to strand up and be counted? SignatureKaty Jennison spamtrap: remove the first two letters after the @ > >Mark Brader: > >> > No it isn't. Some foreign places may have "strand" as a noun, [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > You want us all to strand up and be counted? We could strand up and be cnuted. SignatureMike. >>Mark Brader: >>> > No it isn't. Some foreign places may have "strand" as a noun, [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > >You want us all to strand up and be counted? Have a banana. SignatureOn-line canal route planner: http://www.canalplan.org.uk (Waterways World site of the month, April 2001) My Reply-To address *is* valid, though likely to die soon >>BBC Radio News. 'he was left stranded when his yacht capsized 1000 miles >>out to sea'. Surely 'stranded' is the very last thing he could be in >>that situation? > >Only if you use a very old definition of the word "strand" when it >meant beach or shore (stranding = beaching). Very old it may be, but "strand" is still in used in the names of some beaches in Ireland. Tourist websites sometimes use the form "XYZ Strand beach" presumably for the benefit of those unfamiliar with that meaning of strand. > But contemporary >usage includes the concept of merely being up the creek without >a way to get home. Yes. But I think that "adrift" might have been better than "stranded". SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) > >>BBC Radio News. 'he was left stranded when his yacht capsized 1000 miles > >>out to sea'. Surely 'stranded' is the very last thing he could be in [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > "XYZ Strand beach" presumably for the benefit of those unfamiliar > with that meaning of strand. Apparently the Laytown Races are the last surviving official strand races in Ireland: they were lovingly featured in the latest _Coast_ on BeebTV. (Interesting sery, by the way, in a rather hither-and-thither tellyish way: worth watching if the OtherPondians get the chance. I wonder if the Northern Irish salt mine will ever get to Russia. But I'd love to know the internal politics of which presenter is in and which is out at any given moment.) [...] SignatureMike. >> >>BBC Radio News. 'he was left stranded when his yacht capsized 1000 miles >> >>out to sea'. Surely 'stranded' is the very last thing he could be in [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >is out at any given moment.) >[...] Me too. I'd settle for Alice Roberts as lead presenter all the time. SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) [...] > >Apparently the Laytown Races are the last surviving official strand > >races in Ireland: they were lovingly featured in the latest _Coast_ on [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Me too. I'd settle for Alice Roberts as lead presenter all the time. Not 'alf! I passed her in the street a while back, and had one of those momentary things you get when moderately famous faces see you recognising them, and they feel cornered because they have to work out at once whether it's just from TV or that they ought also to be recognising _you_. I hope I didn't favour her with too grossly carnivorous a look! SignatureMike. |
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