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Discussion Groups / English Usage / January 2007Name changes
We are all familiar with performers who change their names to be more marketable or who record under different names to skirt contract problems. There are, however, performers who use different names for different kinds of music. I invite people to tell us of some of their own favorite name changes, including perhaps a discussion of why they belong on such a list and which persona they prefer. Here are three likely candidates: Georgia Tom Dorsey / Rev. Thomas A. Dorsey Leslie Phillips / Sam Phillips Lucille Bogan / Bessie Jackson Is there a real distinction, for example, in the pair Dollar Brand / Abdullah Ibrahim? [snip] > I invite people to tell us of some of their > own favorite name changes, including perhaps a discussion of why they > belong on such a list and which persona they prefer. [snip] An excerpt from a Wiki article that some may find relevant: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_change "...Famous instances of people renamed by deed poll include Screaming Lord Sutch, 3rd Earl of Harrow, the founder of the Official Monster Raving Loony Party and Elton Hercules John, the singer, composer and musician, who was previously called Reginald Kenneth Dwight. A resident of Leeds, originally named Michael Howard, changed his name by deed poll to "Yorkshire Bank PLC Are Fascist Bastards" after being charged ?20 for a ?10 overdraft, according to the The People newspaper of January 22, 1995. When the bank asked him to close his account, he asked them to repay the 69p balance with a cheque made out in his new name...." Aloha ~~~ Ozzie Maland ~~~ San Diego > We are all familiar with performers who change their names to be more > marketable or who record under different names to skirt contract [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Dollar Brand / Abdullah Ibrahim? You'd sure think so. Well. there's Garth Brooks/Chris Gaines: <http://countrymusic.about.com/od/garthchrisgaines/Garth_Brooks_as_Chris_Gaines.htm>. Garth is country, Clint pop. And then there's Cat Stevens/Yusuf Islam. I believe he's recorded under both names. Many authors use both their own names and one or more pseudonyms, varying their style as they vary the names. They usually own up. These days it's not uncommon to see something like "Joyce Carol Oates writing as Rosamond Smith."[1] Salvatore Lombino was prolific both as Ed McBain and as Evan Hunter (and he legally adopted the latter name). His two personas wrote in different genres, but late in life he published at least one novel as a "collaboration" by them. Wikipedia covers this quite well: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evan_Hunter>. [1] I'm not sure Oates has done this, but others have. I just can't think of one just now.  SignatureBob Lieblich Also published as Rob L. the Liebs, and still others > > We are all familiar with performers who change their names to be more > > marketable or who record under different names to skirt contract [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > You'd sure think so. John R. Peirce wrote technical and semi-popular books under his own name and science fiction as J. J. Coupling (j-j coupling, a quantum-mechanical interaction between particles). <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Robinson_Peirce> > Well. there's Garth Brooks/Chris Gaines: > <http://countrymusic.about.com/od/garthchrisgaines/Garth_Brooks_as_Chris_Gaines.htm>. > Garth is country, Clint pop. And then there's Cat Stevens/Yusuf > Islam. I believe he's recorded under both names. Yes, according to Wikipedia. Mot juste of the day: "This issue of music in Islam is not as cut-and-dried as I was led to believe ... I relied on heresy, that was perhaps my mistake." <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cat_Stevens#Muslim_faith_and_musical_career> > Many authors use both their own names and one or more pseudonyms, > varying their style as they vary the names. They usually own up. > These days it's not uncommon to see something like "Joyce Carol Oates > writing as Rosamond Smith."[1] ... > [1] I'm not sure Oates has done this, but others have. I just can't > think of one just now. Ruth Rendell, writing as Barbara Vine. I suspect the reason for owning up is that the other name sells books. SignatureJerry Friedman >> > We are all familiar with performers who change their names to be more >> > marketable or who record under different names to skirt contract [quoted text clipped - 40 lines] >Ruth Rendell, writing as Barbara Vine. I suspect the reason for owning >up is that the other name sells books. Jack Higgins has published books under several aliases: Martin Fallon, James Graham, Hugh Marlowe, and Harry Patterson (his real name). SignatureRobin Herts, England >>> We are all familiar with performers who change their names to be >>> more marketable or who record under different names to skirt [quoted text clipped - 40 lines] > Ruth Rendell, writing as Barbara Vine. I suspect the reason for > owning up is that the other name sells books. Stephen King as Richard Bachman SignatureJohn Dean Oxford >> [1] I'm not sure Oates has done this, but others have. I just can't >> think of one just now. > >Ruth Rendell, writing as Barbara Vine. I suspect the reason for owning >up is that the other name sells books. Anthony Trollope, on the other hand, published a couple of short books under a pseudonym to see whether they would sell without the famous name attached. Katy K. Edgcombe filted: >>> [1] I'm not sure Oates has done this, but others have. I just can't >>> think of one just now. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >Anthony Trollope, on the other hand, published a couple of short books under a >pseudonym to see whether they would sell without the famous name attached. McCartney did this with a song once for the same reason...the results were inconclusive....r Signature"Keep your eye on the Bishop. I want to know when he makes his move", said the Inspector, obliquely. > K. Edgcombe filted: > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > McCartney did this with a song once for the same reason...the results were > inconclusive....r Didn't Doris Lessing publish some novels under a different name to highlight the problems of new authors? Fran The K. Edgcombe entity posted thusly: >>> [1] I'm not sure Oates has done this, but others have. I just can't >>> think of one just now. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >Anthony Trollope, on the other hand, published a couple of short books under a >pseudonym to see whether they would sell without the famous name attached. A fellow I know, but haven't conversed with for nearly a decade, is the son of a well known science-fiction author. He was in the process of writing a few stories, which he said he would publish under a pseudonym because he did not wish to be successful based only on his father's name. I have not yet seen any of his books, nor would I know the name he published under, if he has published. > Is there a real distinction, for example, in the pair > > Dollar Brand / Abdullah Ibrahim? My understanding is that he started out his performing career (at least once he moved to the US -- he's from Sith Efrica) using "Dollar Brand", maybe thinking it was catchy, but later came to regret it because he found it undignified or not sufficiently serious-sounding, so he started using Abdullah Ibrahim, but I think his effort to disassociate himself from "Dollar Brand" wasn't entirely successful. (I think on some recordings or performance announcements he's billed as "Abdullah Ibrahim (Dollar Brand)" or vice versa.) There might be more accurate info about this out there; I haven't checked. SignatureSalvatore Volatile > We are all familiar with performers who change their names to be more > marketable or who record under different names to skirt contract > problems. There are, however, performers who use different names for > different kinds of music. I invite people to tell us of some of their > own favorite name changes, including perhaps a discussion of why they > belong on such a list and which persona they prefer. Not the same thing, but a related phenomenon is the use of one name for one field of endeavor and another for another. An example that comes to mind is singer Tony Bennett, who paints as "Anthony Benedetto". SignatureSalvatore Volatile Salvatore Volatile filted: >> We are all familiar with performers who change their names to be more >> marketable or who record under different names to skirt contract [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >one field of endeavor and another for another. An example that comes to >mind is singer Tony Bennett, who paints as "Anthony Benedetto". I submit the serious scholar of the blues named Barry Hansen, who plays novelty records on the radio as Dr Demento...and musicologiest Johann Peter Schickele, who bears a striking resemblance to the 18th-century hack composer PDQ Bach....r Signature"Keep your eye on the Bishop. I want to know when he makes his move", said the Inspector, obliquely. > Salvatore Volatile filted: > > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Peter Schickele, who bears a striking resemblance to the 18th-century hack > composer PDQ Bach....r And comedian Drew Carey, who works as a sports photographer under a name that a few minutes of half-hearted searching fails to reveal... SignatureSML [snip] > And comedian Drew Carey, who works as a sports photographer under a name > that a few minutes of half-hearted searching fails to reveal... [snip] Add to that a good half hour of dedicated searching -- he seems to be a master of disguise. Aloha ~~~ Ozzie Maland ~~~ San Diego Sara Lorimer filted: >> I submit the serious scholar of the blues named Barry Hansen, who plays >> novelty records on the radio as Dr Demento...and musicologiest Johann [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >And comedian Drew Carey, who works as a sports photographer under a name >that a few minutes of half-hearted searching fails to reveal... Closer to the spirit of the original request: Buster Poindexter/David Johansen.... I don't think Steven King/Richard Bachman counts...the extra name there came about in an effort to splinter off a fraction of his prodigious output so it wouldn't look like he was writing *quite* so much...a cursory examination of his works under both names reveals no significant attempt at assigning a particular purpose to either....r Signature"Keep your eye on the Bishop. I want to know when he makes his move", said the Inspector, obliquely. > I don't think Steven King/Richard Bachman counts...the extra name there > came about in an effort to splinter off a fraction of his prodigious > output so it wouldn't look like he was writing *quite* so much...a cursory > examination of his works under both names reveals no significant attempt > at assigning a particular purpose to either....r Ah, but his work under the name Joyce Carol Oates is quite different. SignatureSML >> I don't think Steven King/Richard Bachman counts...the extra name there >> came about in an effort to splinter off a fraction of his prodigious [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Ah, but his work under the name Joyce Carol Oates is quite different. I vaguely remember a rather good parody a few years ago of blockbuster fiction in the style of a different blockbuster author -- Jackie Collins in the style of Tom Clancy perhaps? SignatureArchie Valparaiso >> Salvatore Volatile filted: >>> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > And comedian Drew Carey, who works as a sports photographer under a > name that a few minutes of half-hearted searching fails to reveal... And Hank Wangford, country singer extraordinaire, who still works as Dr Sam Hutt in family planning in Eastern Europe. And Iain Banks the novelist who moonlights as Iain M Banks the SF writer. And Ronnie Barker the actor who wrote comedy material as Gerald Wiley. SignatureJohn Dean Oxford >And Hank Wangford, country singer extraordinaire, who still works as Dr Sam >Hutt in family planning in Eastern Europe. >And Iain Banks the novelist who moonlights as Iain M Banks the SF writer. >And Ronnie Barker the actor who wrote comedy material as Gerald Wiley. Well, what about Charles Lutwidge Dodgson? Or, nearer our own time, J.I.M.Stewart? Katy >> And Hank Wangford, country singer extraordinaire, who still works as >> Dr Sam Hutt in family planning in Eastern Europe. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Or, nearer our own time, J.I.M.Stewart? And Currer, Acton and Ellis Bell? And Richard Hearne and Mr Pastry? SignatureJohn Dean Oxford >>>And Hank Wangford, country singer extraordinaire, who still works as >>>Dr Sam Hutt in family planning in Eastern Europe. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > And Currer, Acton and Ellis Bell? And Richard Hearne and Mr Pastry? Mr Pastry wrote books? The things you learn in aue... SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) laura@DRAGONspira.fsbusiness.co.uk had it: > >>>And Hank Wangford, country singer extraordinaire, who still works as > >>>Dr Sam Hutt in family planning in Eastern Europe. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Mr Pastry wrote books? The things you learn in aue... Be careful. You may discover something you'd rather not know (unless it's one of those Wikid fabrications). Wikipedia on Richard Hearne: He was offered the starring role of the BBC series "Doctor Who" after the departure of Jon Pertwee, but a disagreement over his interpretation of the role (he wanted to play the Doctor as Mr. Pastry) led to the invitation being withdrawn by the producer Barry Letts. SignatureDavid ===== the Omrud filted: >Wikipedia on Richard Hearne: >He was offered the starring role of the BBC series "Doctor Who" after >the departure of Jon Pertwee, but a disagreement over his >interpretation of the role (he wanted to play the Doctor as Mr. >Pastry) led to the invitation being withdrawn by the producer Barry >Letts. Actors and actresses with multiple names, anyone?.... Angela Dorian/Victoria Vetri Suzanne Cupito/Morgan Brittany Veronica Hart/Jane Hamilton Terence Hill/Mario Girotti Roscoe Arbuckle/William Goodrich ....r Signature"Keep your eye on the Bishop. I want to know when he makes his move", said the Inspector, obliquely. > the Omrud filted: > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Terence Hill/Mario Girotti > Roscoe Arbuckle/William Goodrich Should I know who these people are? I found myself inadvertently watching some moments fromthe start of Celebrity Big Brother the other day. I had never heard of any of the participants (apart from Ken Russell) and it appeared as they tentatively greeted each other that none of them had heard of each other either. This didn't stop them greeting each other most affectionately. SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) >> the Omrud filted: >> [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > tentatively greeted each other that none of them had heard of each other > either. This didn't stop them greeting each other most affectionately. According to IMDb, Veronica Hart was a "Respected porn star of the 70s and 80s". That might explain why she had so many different stage names. Fran >>> the Omrud filted: >>> [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > According to IMDb, Veronica Hart was a "Respected porn star of the 70s > and 80s". That might explain why she had so many different stage names. The notion of a "respected porn star" is almost as bizarre as the idea of Y-K-W being locked up by the boys in blue for asking about a guardsman's underwear. "They're changing sex at Buckingham Palace.." etc SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) Frances Kemmish filted: >>> Actors and actresses with multiple names, anyone?.... >>> [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >According to IMDb, Veronica Hart was a "Respected porn star of the 70s >and 80s". That might explain why she had so many different stage names. She was *very* well-known under that name in the 70s and 80s in the porn industry, which made it all the more confusing when she suddenly started turning up in mainstream films under her real name.... To help out Frances somewhat: Angela Dorian had been Playboy's Playmate of the Month (and then of the Year) and so was presumably familiar to most adult and adolescent males of that era, when she appeared in the lead role in "When Dinosaurs Ruled the Earth" as Victoria Vetri, a movie certain to be seen by the same demographic.... Suzanne Cupito was a prolific child actress of the 50s and 60s, playing "Baby June" in the movie version of "Gypsy"...she resurfaced as an adult under the name Morgan Brittany, and appeared for a time on the series "Dallas".... Terence Hill was the English name chosen by Mario Girotti as the star of the movie "My Name is Trinity" and its sequels...his co-star in those films was variously known as Bud Spencer and Carlo Pedersoli.... You probably know Roscoe Arbuckle as "Fatty"...don't call him that on alt.movies.silent, though, unless you're talking about the character he played....r Signature"Keep your eye on the Bishop. I want to know when he makes his move", said the Inspector, obliquely. >According to IMDb, Veronica Hart was a "Respected porn star of the 70s >and 80s". That might explain why she had so many different stage names. Being accustomed to adopting a variety of positions I suppose it was not much of a stretch for her to adopt a variety of names. SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) >I found myself inadvertently watching some moments fromthe start of >Celebrity Big Brother the other day. I had never heard of any of the >participants (apart from Ken Russell) and it appeared as they >tentatively greeted each other that none of them had heard of each other >either. This didn't stop them greeting each other most affectionately. The public will be voting according to the likeability, etc. of each housemate. It's best for the HMs to get off to a pleasant and polite start. I had heard of eight of the eleven who entered the house on the first day. (I'm not sure whether to be proud or ashamed of that.) SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) > I found myself inadvertently watching some moments fromthe start of > Celebrity Big Brother the other day. I had never heard of any of the > participants (apart from Ken Russell) and it appeared as they > tentatively greeted each other that none of them had heard of each > other either. This didn't stop them greeting each other most > affectionately. You mean you never watched Kenny Everett in the 80s? SignatureLinz Wet Yorks via Cambridge, York, London and Watford My accent may vary >>I found myself inadvertently watching some moments fromthe start of >>Celebrity Big Brother the other day. I had never heard of any of the [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > You mean you never watched Kenny Everett in the 80s? Indeed I did, but I didn't make the connection. She looked remarkably well preserved, considering. SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) >>> I found myself inadvertently watching some moments fromthe start of >>> Celebrity Big Brother the other day. I had never heard of any of the [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Indeed I did, but I didn't make the connection. She looked remarkably > well preserved, considering. One of my friends suggests she had a picture in her attic. SignatureLinz Wet Yorks via Cambridge, York, London and Watford My accent may vary > the Omrud filted: >> [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Terence Hill/Mario Girotti > Roscoe Arbuckle/William Goodrich I won't say I was obsessed by "Q" on Star Trek, but he always reminded me of Shepherd Strudwick. (That actor, by the way, also appeared in "All the King's Men. The Loves of Edgar Allan Poe (1942); Poe is played by John Shepherd (sometimes known as Shepherd Strudwick). Danza macabra (1964) horror film directed by ... >> Well, what about Charles Lutwidge Dodgson? >> >> Or, nearer our own time, J.I.M.Stewart? > >And Currer, Acton and Ellis Bell? And Richard Hearne and Mr Pastry? But the Bells were simply pseudonyms (and surely two at least of them never published under any other name?). Currer may later have published under her own name; I can't remember. But that's rather different from publishing different types of book (possibly over the same period of time) under two different names - as did both my examples. Katy > >And Hank Wangford, country singer extraordinaire, who still works as Dr Sam > >Hutt in family planning in Eastern Europe. > >And Iain Banks the novelist who moonlights as Iain M Banks the SF writer. > >And Ronnie Barker the actor who wrote comedy material as Gerald Wiley. > Well, what about Charles Lutwidge Dodgson? > Or, nearer our own time, J.I.M.Stewart? Agatha Christie wrote romantic novels as Mary Westmacott. And now I see there's a discussion of noms de plume at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pen_name and a list of notable ones at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pen_name#Notable_pen_names For example, "Acton Bell, Currer Bell, and Ellis Bell (Anne Brontë, Charlotte Brontë, Emily Brontë)" and "Mark Twain (Samuel Langhorne Clemens)". >For example, "Acton Bell, Currer Bell, and Ellis Bell (Anne >Brontë, Charlotte Brontë, Emily Brontë)" Their family name was originally Prunty. Their father was born in Ireland, migrated to England and at some point changed his surname to Brontë. SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) >> For example, "Acton Bell, Currer Bell, and Ellis Bell (Anne >> Brontë, Charlotte Brontë, Emily Brontë)" > > Their family name was originally Prunty. Their father was born in > Ireland, migrated to England and at some point changed his surname > to Brontë. In honour of Horatio Nelson SignatureJohn Dean Oxford >>> For example, "Acton Bell, Currer Bell, and Ellis Bell (Anne >>> Bront?Charlotte Bront?Emily Bront? [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >In honour of Horatio Nelson Interesting. The web pages I found suggested, with varying degrees of conviction, that it was in honour of the Duke of Wellington. They say that Bronte was one of Wellington's names or titles. No cites or references were given. [I've typed Bronte with a plain 'e' to maintain readability because the correct form tends to get mangled by some posters' newsreaders.] SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) >>>> For example, "Acton Bell, Currer Bell, and Ellis Bell (Anne >>>> Bront?Charlotte Bront?Emily Bront? [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Bronte was one of Wellington's names or titles. > No cites or references were given. As indeed they could not, Bronte having no connection with Nosey. > [I've typed Bronte with a plain 'e' to maintain readability because > the correct form tends to get mangled by some posters' newsreaders.] You can find plenty of references to the fact that Bronte was one of Nelson's titles eg: http://www.twogreens.com/wakeup/nelson/body_back.htm From the plate on Nelson's coffin (His full titles) Depositum The most Noble Lord Horatio Nelson Viscount and Baron Nelson of the Nile, And of Burnham Thorpe in the county of Norfolk, Baron Nelson of the Nile, and of Hilborough, in the said County Knight of the Most Noble Order of the Bath Vice-Admiral of the White Squadron of the Fleet And Commander-in-Chief of his Majesty's Ships and vessels In the Mediterranean Also Duke of Bronte in Sicily Knight Grand Cross of the Sicilian Order of St Ferdinand and of Merit Member of the Ottoman Order of the Crescent; and Knight Grand Commander of the Order of St Joachim SignatureJohn Dean Oxford >>>>> For example, "Acton Bell, Currer Bell, and Ellis Bell (Anne >>>>> Bront?Charlotte Bront?Emily Bront? [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] >Member of the Ottoman Order of the Crescent; and >Knight Grand Commander of the Order of St Joachim Thank you. I clearly stumbled on the wrong websites. SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) > You can find plenty of references to the fact that Bronte was one of > Nelson's titles eg: [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > Member of the Ottoman Order of the Crescent; and > Knight Grand Commander of the Order of St Joachim From this, he made a living? SignatureRoland Hutchinson Will play viola da gamba for food. NB mail to my.spamtrap [at] verizon.net is heavily filtered to remove spam. If your message looks like spam I may not see it. >>>>> For example, "Acton Bell, Currer Bell, and Ellis Bell (Anne >>>>> Bront?Charlotte Bront?Emily Bront? [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] >Member of the Ottoman Order of the Crescent; and >Knight Grand Commander of the Order of St Joachim And, although Nelson's British titles are long extinct, his dukedom of Bronte still exists. Its current holder is Alexander Nelson Hood, 4th Viscount Bridport, who is descended from the Admiral's niece. SignatureDon Aitken Mail to the From: address is not read. To email me, substitute "clara.co.uk" for "freeuk.com" In alt.usage.english, John Dean wrote: >> [I've typed Bronte with a plain 'e' to maintain readability because >> the correct form tends to get mangled by some posters' newsreaders.] > >You can find plenty of references to the fact that Bronte was one of >Nelson's titles eg: The award of that title wasn't at all popular in Bronte. The townsfolk had only recently freed themselves - after a lawsuit that had lasted for three centuries - from an illegal vassalage and there they were again back where they had started, only it was worse this time because the new overlord was an overmilord: a foreigner and a heretic, a runty anti-republican democratic-massacring patriot-hanging Bourbonite Englishman. Infamia! See: http://www.bronteinsieme.it/BrIns_en/2st_en/nelson_en.html The ducal lands weren't returned to the local people until the early 1960s and the Brontese are still bitter. When Bronte was twinned with Nelson's birthplace about ten years ago, many of them were left puzzled and astonished ... What affinity of traditions, of realizations, of purposes there was between the two countries however remained a mystery. ... Maybe that mayor of ours had forgotten (or, maybe, completely ignored) the sour quarrel between the Dukedom and the Council Of Bronte that went on for over a century, the vassalage state, the bullying and the offences, the suffered injustices, the dead of 1860, the hard rural struggles. (The "dead of 1860" were the memorable "fatti di Bronte", supersized biscuit-eaters who went looking for Bourbons in the Abbey of the Maniacs only to be squashed flat by their own Garibaldis.) SignatureV Cappelli guaddativi, l’ura du giudizziu s’avvicina, populu non mancari all’appellu! > In alt.usage.english, John Dean wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > http://www.bronteinsieme.it/BrIns_en/2st_en/nelson_en.html Excellent link. Thanks SignatureJohn Dean Oxford mambuhl@earthlink.net had it: > We are all familiar with performers who change their names to be more > marketable or who record under different names to skirt contract > problems. There are, however, performers who use different names for > different kinds of music. I invite people to tell us of some of their > own favorite name changes, including perhaps a discussion of why they > belong on such a list and which persona they prefer. The Scottish novelist Iain Menzies Banks writes "straight" novels as "Iain Banks" and fantasy/SF as "Iain M Banks". BTW, I have a colleague named Iain, and I find that most non-UK folk can't pronounce his name. It's simply a Scottish spelling of "Ian". SignatureDavid ===== Nope. Gravity under Vista got worse. Back to XP. >mambuhl@earthlink.net had it: >> We are all familiar with performers who change their names to be more [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >BTW, I have a colleague named Iain, and I find that most non-UK folk >can't pronounce his name. It's simply a Scottish spelling of "Ian". Tchah. Over on my other group, the Iaiaiaiains have long out-numbered the Ians. My favourite has two Is but only one eyebrow. SignatureLinz Wet Yorks via Cambridge, York, London and Watford My accent may vary > >BTW, I have a colleague named Iain, and I find that most non-UK folk > >can't pronounce his name. It's simply a Scottish spelling of "Ian". > > Tchah. Over on my other group, the Iaiaiaiains have long out-numbered > the Ians. My favourite has two Is but only one eyebrow. I have never really looked at his eyebrows before but yes, I see what you mean. I prefer the one I over here, of course. Jac >> >BTW, I have a colleague named Iain, and I find that most non-UK folk >> >can't pronounce his name. It's simply a Scottish spelling of "Ian". [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >I have never really looked at his eyebrows before but yes, I see what >you mean. He is well-known for having a monobrow. >I prefer the one I over here, of course. That's understandable, and the ideal situation, I feel! SignatureLinz Wet Yorks via Cambridge, York, London and Watford My accent may vary [ ... ] > Tchah. Over on my other group, the Iaiaiaiains have long out-numbered > the Ians. My favourite has two Is but only one eyebrow. So Ma and Pa Cyclops should name their kid Ian {sic] -- right? SignatureBob Lieblich With binocular surname >[ ... ] > >> Tchah. Over on my other group, the Iaiaiaiains have long out-numbered >> the Ians. My favourite has two Is but only one eyebrow. > >So Ma and Pa Cyclops should name their kid Ian {sic] -- right? Good point. SignatureLinz Wet Yorks via Cambridge, York, London and Watford My accent may vary Amethyst Deceiver filted: >>[ ... ] >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >Good point. But because it's so hard to remember, they can call him Polyphemos for short....r Signature"Keep your eye on the Bishop. I want to know when he makes his move", said the Inspector, obliquely. (snipped) > So Ma and Pa Cyclops should name their kid Ian {sic] -- right? Ah ha! A well justified reason for nitpicking! "{sic]" [sic] You are found guilty, in the court of public opinion, of having a zealous left little finger which compelled your right little finger to commit an act of homicide upon a left hand bracket. Guilty! Guilty! You are also found guilty of a second count of wanton and criminal negligence for not editing your articles. Guilty! Guilty! Any fool can nitpick. Not many fools can think creatively. I should be a barrister! Taha - seductively removing her judge's black robe http://www.purlgurl.net/~stocks/audio/naked.wav > (snipped) > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > [sic] Sick. I.L. -- ill. SignatureArnold Stang (snipped) >> Ah ha! A well justified reason for nitpicking! >> "{sic]" >>[sic] > Sick. Robert, have you enjoyed the movie, "A Beautiful Mind" which is a true story of John Nash, a Nobel prize winner? If not, you should! Amongst the greatest challenges of language usage, more specifically, comprehension of language usage, is creativity usage. John Nash is not insane. John Nash is beautifully creative! I believe he still is, still alive although he would be very old, today. Yes, he suffers or did suffer schizophrenia, but his mind expressed disjointed thoughts so wonderfully! Not that I consider schizophrenia a blessing, by no means. Nonetheless, his delusions were so creatively written by his mind, a reflection of his genius. A casual glance, most, if not almost all, would dismiss John Nash as a crazy person. However, knowing of John Nash dramatically alters our perception of him. His winning a Nobel leads us to overlook this insane side of his personality. However, this is not my context. My context is should we read a story based on delusions of John Nash, with no reference to Nash, this would make a beautiful story, even a thrilling espionage story! Once Nash and his delusions are separated, his delusions are quite rational and most creative. True context here is our creative abilities, especially with language, are borderline delusional thoughts, if not near schizophrenia, albeit under control schizophrenia, unlike those delusional thoughts of John Nash. You view my parody on "[sic]" as sick. I view my parody as highly creative. This suggests to me you have fully suppressed your creative side, suppressed your ability to "listen" to inherent schizophrenia within your mind. This also suggests, to me, within my mind, I do listen to my schizophrenia and, in turn, produce highly creative thinking, sans harmful delusions. John Nash, a highly creative genius who could not control his thoughts, without help. However, what beautiful wild thoughts! Are we to judge creative linguists as crazy? I think not! I think we should open our minds to those creative thoughts of others, rather than close our minds, drop our minds into an "oubliette" darkness. When we close our minds, we confine ourselves to a mental oubliette, a prison which requires climbing a high ladder of learning to escape. Taha > (snipped) > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > > Sick. [ ... ] > You view my parody on "[sic]" as sick. Not so. You missed a reference. Since all we seem to do is talk past each other, I'll drop it there. [ ... ] (snipped) >>>Sick. >>You view my parody on "[sic]" as sick. > Not so. You missed a reference. Nah, I am twisting your context to establish context for my prior delusional rant about John Nash, a beautiful rant I must add! Reminds me of a story, as almost any single word does. Recently I provide a photograph of me waving my wet thong over a campfire to dry. I comment on my dried thong making my crotch smell of a brush fire, a great quip, especially with my adding commentary about camping tent romance. Later, I confess to actually drying my bra which leads to another very long and very comical story, a story about snow camping and burning two holes in my bra right where those holes count the most! There are times I do deliberately twist context but am careful only to do this in the company of humor if not comedy. I am fair about this. Sometimes, though, I simply lie. > Since all we seem to do is talk past each other, I'll drop it there. Nah, nah, you talk past me, I talk over you. Ha! Taha http://www.purlgurl.net/~stocks/graphics/misc/camp02.jpg purlgurl@purlgurl.net had it: > Amongst the greatest challenges of language usage, more specifically, > comprehension of language usage, is creativity usage. John Nash is > not insane. John Nash is beautifully creative! I believe he still > is, still alive although he would be very old, today. 79 is hardly "very old" these days (cf Dad). SignatureDavid ===== >(snipped) >> So Ma and Pa Cyclops should name their kid Ian {sic] -- right? >Ah ha! A well justified reason for nitpicking! >"{sic]" >[sic] If you're going to pick nits, those should be () and not [] or {}, because the author was commenting self-referentially and not editing another's words. John SignatureJohn Chew (poslfit on MD) * jjchew@math.utoronto.ca * http://www.poslfit.com (snipped) >>"{sic]" >>[sic] > If you're going to pick nits, those should be () and not [] or {}, > because the author was commenting self-referentially and not editing > another's words. http://www.askoxford.com/asktheexperts/faq/usage/sic http://www.grammarbook.com/punctuation/quotes.asp http://andromeda.rutgers.edu/~jlynch/Writing/s.html We use sic — italicized (but not underlined) and in square brackets, as in [sic] to indicate that a word in a quotation was misspelled or otherwise miscast in the original language. We should use this only when it is really important to retain the original spelling and grammar for some ethical or historical reason. Otherwise, it is regarded as bad manners to retain the mistaken language. If misspellings litter the quoted language, it would be better to note at the beginning of the text that you are using the original. To pepper your quotation with here-a-sic, there-a-sic simply becomes annoying. Authority: New York Public Library Writer's Guide to Style and Usage HarperCollins: New York. 1994. Cited with permission. p. 304. http://grammar.ccc.commnet.edu/grammar/grammarlogs4/grammarlogs534.htm http://www.dailygrammar.com/436to440.shtml http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sic Taha >>>"{sic]" >>>[sic] [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >in [sic] to indicate that a word in a quotation was misspelled or otherwise >miscast in the original language. Yes, that's quite kind of you to explain to me why my criticism was well-founded. You've hit the nail on the head. Bob should not have used square brackets, because square brackets are used to distinguish the editorial voice from the quotation. Here, he was parenthetically commenting on his own words, so he should have used (round) parentheses. John SignatureJohn Chew (poslfit on MD) * jjchew@math.utoronto.ca * http://www.poslfit.com > Yes, that's quite kind of you to explain to me why my criticism was > well-founded. You've hit the nail on the head. Oh no, you do not! You will not twist my words around to sooth your fragile masculine ego! Nope. My article clearly does not defend your position. There are technical issues with which I might agree. However, I am defending my nemisis barrister usage of [sic] in his article. Bobby is displaying humor which is appreciated and allows for language slaughter, not that he is known for slaughtering English, too often, maybe sometimes, well, perhaps more often than expected. > Bob should not have used square brackets, because square brackets are > used to distinguish the editorial voice from the quotation. Here, he > was parenthetically commenting on his own words, so he should have used > (round) parentheses. I am neutral on this technical point. I cannot recall encountering these circumstances previously. I agree there is a founded argument parentheses should be used. This makes sense in a context of an original author adding unrelated commentary to his concurrent writings. However, there is also a founded argument, using strict grammar rules, an editoral insertion noting misspelling, even an author's concurrent writings, should be used. Other words, an argument could be presented Bobby used correct syntax for editing his own concurrent words; he is editing his own words. On this hand, there is a case supporting use of parentheses. On that hand, a case supporting use of brackets. Which is correct? I have no clue but a clue is you are twisting my words into something I did not write. I do not play that game. Should I critique Bobby, this would be for his having a Lazy Tongue and a stiff upper lip. Should I critique you, this would be for your taking all this a bit too seriously. Whatever, this is of no real importance but is enjoyable for thought. Bobby is cracking a joke, his humor is appreciated and he is granted a license to slaughter English for a joke. Taha - defense barrister for Bobby the barrister > Oh no, you do not! You will not twist my words around to sooth > your fragile masculine ego! Nope. You miswrote "sooth" for "soothe" and "fragile" for "impressive". >My article clearly does not defend your position. There are technical >issues with which I might agree. However, I am defending my nemisis >barrister usage of [sic] in his article. Bobby is displaying humor >which is appreciated and allows for language slaughter, not that >he is known for slaughtering English, too often, maybe sometimes, >well, perhaps more often than expected. I did not mean to cause offence, either to Bobby or his supporters, and apologize for having done so. In my limited social circle, to declare that one is nitpicking (as he did), is an invitation to all present to engage in mutual nitpicking, descending if necessary to the level of pointing out misspellings, bad grammar or misuse of punctuation. Clearly, I hadn't been following a.u.e. long enough to become aware that pointing out such errors was a faux pas. John SignatureJohn Chew (poslfit on MD) * jjchew@math.utoronto.ca * http://www.poslfit.com > > Oh no, you do not! You will not twist my words around to sooth > > your fragile masculine ego! Nope. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > Clearly, I hadn't been following a.u.e. long enough to become aware > that pointing out such errors was a faux pas. I wrote the original offending sentence, reproduced here in all its glory: So Ma and Pa Cyclops should name their kid Ian {sic] -- right? PG commented (in her usual snide fashion) that the initial { should have been a square bracket [ and I should therefore have written "[sic]". John Chew then commented that both marks should have been parenthesis marks (or whatever they're called in the UK) "(sic)" -- because I was siccing not someone else's text but my own. And, as do most dialogues with PG, it went downhill from there. To the extent that there's a "right" answer, I think it's probably John's -- parenthesis marks -- thought I don't consider square brackets all that much of an error. As a lawyer, I'm so in the habit of putting "sic" in square brackets that in this case I did so reflexively without considering John's point. Confusion was compounded by my accidentally upshifting (or whatever the computer equivalent is) the left-hand bracket and generating a curly bracket { instead. Had I been around when this subthread started, I'd probably have posted agreement with John -- and probably triggered even more persiflage from PG. We need not imagine what this post will trigger; we need only wait. In the "no nit too small" spirit of AUE, I thank John for his comment. I know no offense was intended, and I assure him that none was taken. (Good general rule: never assume that PG's characterization of anyone -- herself included -- is accurate.) I'll try to be more careful the next time I get that "sic" feeling. SignatureBob Lieblich Not to old to learn >To the extent that there's a "right" answer, I think it's probably >John's -- parenthesis marks -- thought I don't consider square [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >characterization of anyone -- herself included -- is accurate.) I'll >try to be more careful the next time I get that "sic" feeling. Thanks, Bob. I suffer from both sticky-shift-key syndrome (I usually sign my name "J O backspace o h n") and a phobia of incompletely picked nits; thank you for your understanding. John SignatureJohn Chew (poslfit on MD) * jjchew@math.utoronto.ca * http://www.poslfit.com (snipped) >> "{sic]" >> [sic] > If you're going to pick nits, those should be () and not [] or {}, > because the author was commenting self-referentially and not editing > another's words. For readers, original context, BEGIN Amethyst Deceiver wrote: [ ... ] > Tchah. Over on my other group, the Iaiaiaiains have long out-numbered > the Ians. My favourite has two Is but only one eyebrow. So Ma and Pa Cyclops should name their kid Ian {sic] -- right? END Parenthetical enclosures, for this specific case example, noting there are exceptions, for this example a parenthetical enclosure would be used to insert an almost unrelated, if not unrelated thought. We make use of a semicolon to add a moderately related thought, or to add an explanation which moves into deeper detail than surrounding context; an explanation to assist understanding. A semicolon serves to link a somewhat unrelated topic yet still related. Parenthetical enclosures are most often used to insert a virtually unrelated topic, a passing thought (such as your lack of humor) to add to topic but these enclosed thoughts venture very far from a contextual topic. For Robert's writings, well, not sure if a semicolon link would work best or a parenthetical enclosure would work best. A [sic] does not fit all that well. His double hyphens are noteworthy but this is, I believe in his case, cultural inflection. Rather clear he is not writing poetry wherein "- -" and similar is quite common; a rhetorical pause. I am sure my labeling use of dashed enjambement (my spell check kicks this back; enjambment) as a rhetorical pause will certainly raise eyebrows. Nonetheless, a rhetorical pause is created (Dickenson style) by dashes which does not conform with strict definition of a rhetorical pause. Besides, most impossible to distinguish hyphens from dashes; easier to simply label those things a rhetorical pause. Back to topic (I tend to chicken walk) Robert's writings are intended to be amusing and his comments are amusing, just as my retort about his little fingers being a bit wild, is intended to be amusing. My final judgement upon our favorite barrister is he does display a sense of humor although a bit too British dry for my taste. Still, I enjoy his humor even with his lack of ability to move his upper lip while cracking a joke. My final judgement upon you, Mr. Chew (nice rhyme Taha!), is, "GET A F-n SENSE OF HUMOR!" I do NOT like parenthetical enclosures. This is a device employed by lazy tongue writers who are not willing to invest effort into turning an unrelated topic, into a related topic. My writings, up there, annoying, yes? All those parenthetical enclosures make for difficult reading. * twiddles her thumbs, shoves a crochet hook into her ear * Ear, reminds me of an advertisement on my server, http://www.purlgurl.net/~stocks/graphics/ads/010.jpg Taha >* twiddles her thumbs, shoves a crochet hook into her ear * Ouch. Please tell me you meant to put it onto, not into your ear. Or were you aiming badly for a transorbital lobotomy? John SignatureJohn Chew (poslfit on MD) * jjchew@math.utoronto.ca * http://www.poslfit.com >> * twiddles her thumbs, shoves a crochet hook into her ear * > > Ouch. Please tell me you meant to put it onto, not into your ear. > Or were you aiming badly for a transorbital lobotomy? You've not met Purl Gurl and her strange ideas before, have you? >>> * twiddles her thumbs, shoves a crochet hook into her ear * >> >> Ouch. Please tell me you meant to put it onto, not into your ear. >> Or were you aiming badly for a transorbital lobotomy? > >You've not met Purl Gurl and her strange ideas before, have you? I had heard of her, but this is my first conversation with her. She seems quite unusual for a Perl programmer; less so for a gurl. John SignatureJohn Chew (poslfit on MD) * jjchew@math.utoronto.ca * http://www.poslfit.com >>>> * twiddles her thumbs, shoves a crochet hook into her ear * >>> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > I had heard of her, but this is my first conversation with her. > She seems quite unusual for a Perl programmer; less so for a gurl. Trust me, she's unusual for a gurl too. SignatureLinz Wet Yorks via Cambridge, York, London and Watford My accent may vary The John J. Chew III entity posted thusly: >>>> * twiddles her thumbs, shoves a crochet hook into her ear * >>> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >I had heard of her, but this is my first conversation with her. >She seems quite unusual for a Perl programmer; less so for a gurl. She's knit all that unusual, for certain spellings of her name. > You've not met Purl Gurl and her strange ideas before, have you? I am Ray Bradbury's Last Martian. "You are a ghost." "No, you are a ghost." Ha! All in life is a matter of perspective. I am not strange. You are strange. I am the norm, you are the oddity. I travel over to London to visit your aged infirmity, your stiff, unyielding, dogmatic treasures of antiquity. Within hours I am arrested and tossed into Her Majesty's Dungeon. You travel to our tribal lands to visit our naturally flowing, yielding, dynamic lifestyle of greater antiquity than your own. Within hours you are scalped and tossed off our lands. During my visit to London, I discover a cultural wall, an imposing wall which will not yield to an inquisitive mind, "What is behind this wall? I want to see truth, I want to know what you people are really like rather than know the nothingness of royal guards who stand like stiff statues for hours, dressed for elitist pomposity." I am tossed into a dungeon for daring to ask you Brits to drop your fancy pants so I can see what you really have. During your visit to our tribal lands you are confronted with naked peoples, confronted with rivers, lakes, mountains and endless blue skies, and nearly trampled by buffalo running free. You are confronted with wild Mother Nature, then scalped for demanding we construct a wall of dogmatic laws and religions to confine, to bind, to surround and control our dangerously wild natural ways. When you walk your English urban areas, I am quite certain you do not see this boundless beauty of our cultural urban lifestyle. http://www.purlgurl.net/~choctaw/graphics/powwow/pw019.jpg Upon visiting your royal palace of psychotic grandiosity, does your queen stand upon a clean dirt road to pose for a personal picture as do our tribal leaders? http://www.purlgurl.net/~choctaw/graphics/powwow/pw020.jpg I am not a ghost, you are a ghost, a ghost of what is lost to dogmatic civilized cultural norms. I am most certain I am not the strange one around this juke joint. Taha >> You've not met Purl Gurl and her strange ideas before, have you? > > I am Ray Bradbury's Last Martian. [...] > During your visit to our tribal lands you are confronted with naked > peoples, confronted with rivers, lakes, mountains and endless blue > skies, and nearly trampled by buffalo running free. There are a few of those in Saskatchewan now. I saw them being released last Spring, on CBC Newsworld: an emotional moment. http://www.cbc.ca/canada/saskatchewan/story/2006/05/25/sk-buffalo060525.html http://tinyurl.com/yl9498 [...] >>skies, and nearly trampled by buffalo running free. > There are a few of those in Saskatchewan now. I saw them being > released last Spring, on CBC Newsworld: an emotional moment. > http://www.cbc.ca/canada/saskatchewan/story/2006/05/25/sk-buffalo060525.html "It keeps the whole prairie much more healthy if grazing is there," Penny said. "The hoof action, the animals grazing, the bison wallowing and all of that will all help to ensure the health and integrity of the prairie into the future." Five-thousand years or so of intense development of civilized living arrangements and our kind, our humankind, is just learning Mother Nature is the smartest of all. Seems some of us have finally peeked out a tiny window of our rat-trap flats stacked atop of each other like cardboard boxes in a warehouse for holding the public. Nonetheless, we are still adamant about killing each other for the sake of asphalt paved conformity. We declared war upon Mother Nature thousands of years back. We still fight this war, and we still lose on a daily basis. Mother Nature is the mightiest of all warriors; She can never be conquered. What a wonderful world would be ours if we enjoyed arrested development a good ten-thousand years back. Taha - Walk with the Earth, not upon Her [...] > > During your visit to our tribal lands you are [...] nearly > > trampled by buffalo running free. > There are a few of those in Saskatchewan now. I saw them being > released last Spring, on CBC Newsworld: an emotional moment. > http://www.cbc.ca/canada/saskatchewan/story/2006/05/25/sk-buffalo060525.html > http://tinyurl.com/yl9498 Last time we were at Yellowstone National Park, we saw buffalo running free. At least they were running freer than we were, because we had to sit and wait for a few dozen of them to cross the road in front of us. But they weren't really running; they were more like proceeding in a leisurely manner. We saw buffalo running relatively free during our stay at Zion Mountain Resort in Southern Utah. They roam freely on several hundred acres of grassland and forest. http://www.exw6sxq.com/sparky/images/buffalo/4017.jpg http://www.exw6sxq.com/sparky/images/buffalo/4019.jpg http://www.exw6sxq.com/sparky/images/buffalo/4054.jpg And they're free to eat or not eat the hay that's thrown to them each day. http://www.exw6sxq.com/sparky/images/buffalo/4026.jpg You can read about Zion Mountain Resort, with which I have no affiliation, at http://www.zionmountainresort.com/ > We saw buffalo running relatively free during our stay at Zion > Mountain Resort in Southern Utah. They roam freely on several > hundred acres of grassland and forest. Daniel Dennett made the interesting ovservation that Napoleon was imprisoned on Elbe (some 55,000 acres), and yet the animals that lived there, who had no way of leaving, were not. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |There is something fascinating 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |about science. One gets such Palo Alto, CA 94304 |wholesale returns of conjecture out |of such a trifling investment of kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com |fact. (650)857-7572 | Mark Twain http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ > Daniel Dennett made the interesting ovservation that Napoleon was > imprisoned on Elbe I appear to be uneble to spell today. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |English is about as pure as a 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |cribhouse whore. We don't just Palo Alto, CA 94304 |borrow words; on occasion, English |has pursued other languages down kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com |alleyways to beat them unconscious (650)857-7572 |and rifle their pockets for new |vocabulary. http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ | --James D. Nicoll > During my visit to London, I discover a cultural wall, an imposing > wall which will not yield to an inquisitive mind, I didn't see that on my last visit to London. I was in a Marriott hotel at Swiss Cottage, spending the weekend with Scrabble players from around the world (including the late Graeme Thomas). It's possible I was on the inside of a cultural wall; likely, in fact, given the looks we got. > During your visit to our tribal lands you are confronted with naked > peoples, confronted with rivers, lakes, mountains and endless blue > skies, and nearly trampled by buffalo running free. I look forward to this sort of thing whenever I leave the city where I live. >When you walk your English urban areas, I am quite certain you do >not see this boundless beauty of our cultural urban lifestyle. > >http://www.purlgurl.net/~choctaw/graphics/powwow/pw019.jpg Nope, can't really see the boundless beauty. It reminds me a little of Tattoine. Can you expand a bit on what you find beautiful about it? >Upon visiting your royal palace of psychotic grandiosity, >does your queen stand upon a clean dirt road to pose for a >personal picture as do our tribal leaders? On my parents' piano is a photo of me standing with my queen's local representative, the Honourable Pauline McGibbon, sometime around 1980. I believe it was taken at Croft Chapter House at the University of Toronto, which is not a clean dirt road, but does feature an easily removable conical roof, a legacy of its past use as a chemistry laboratory. >I am most certain I am not the strange one around this juke joint. Nor the only one who has charm, beauty or truth, or who is up or down. John SignatureJohn Chew (poslfit on MD) * jjchew@math.utoronto.ca * http://www.poslfit.com "Robert Lieblich" <r_s_lieblich@yahoo.com> wrote in message > So Ma and Pa Cyclops should name their kid Ian {sic] -- right? Or Isaiah. SignatureRay UK -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I am using the free version of SPAMfighter for private users. It has removed 1048 spam emails to date. Paying users do not have this message in their emails. Try SPAMfighter for free now! > The Scottish novelist Iain Menzies Banks writes "straight" novels as > "Iain Banks" and fantasy/SF as "Iain M Banks". He used to, but his latest Culture novel-- in the fantasy/SF genre-- is credited to "Iain Banks". Poking at Amazon reveals that they think "Consider Phlebas" (his first Culture novel, I think) is credited to Iain Banks *and* Iain M. Banks (emphasis mine). Also, Feersum Endjinn (my favourite of his books, but very, um, idiosyncratic in style) is written by "Iain Banks", and if that ain't SF, I want to know what is. > BTW, I have a colleague named Iain, and I find that most non-UK folk > can't pronounce his name. It's simply a Scottish spelling of "Ian". I think everybody I know who likes that author pronounces it 'ian'. -=Eric > We are all familiar with performers who change their names to be > more marketable or who record under different names to skirt [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Leslie Phillips / Sam Phillips > Lucille Bogan / Bessie Jackson Stanley Martin Lieber almost counts as a writer. When he went into the comic book business in the early '40s, he used the name Stan Lee, saving his more dignified "real name" for the novels he would oneday write. But never did. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |He who will not reason, is a bigot; 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |he who cannot is a fool; and he who Palo Alto, CA 94304 |dares not is a slave. | Sir William Drummond kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ >> We are all familiar with performers who change their names to be >> more marketable or who record under different names to skirt [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Lee, saving his more dignified "real name" for the novels he would > oneday write. But never did. Oh, yeah. We can't forget Dr. Paul Myron Anthony Linebarger, author of _Psychological Warfare_ and _The Political Doctrines of Sun-Yat- Sen_, among others, who also wrote science fiction under the name Cordwainer Smith. Also, Robert Silverberg (anther science fiction writer) wrote pornography under the name Don Elliot. Robert Heinlein had several pseudonyms. Anson MacDonald wrote the non-Future-History stories bought by editor John Campbell (who himself wrote fiction under the name Don Stuart), while stories Campbell didn't want were written by Lyle Monroe. Caleb Saunders, John Riverside, and Simon York each wrote one piece, the last a detective story. (His two "girls' stories" were, interestingly, written by "R.A. Heinlein".) MacDonald was created largely because Campbell didn't want a single writer to have more than one story in a given issue. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |There are just two rules of 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |governance in a free society: Mind Palo Alto, CA 94304 |your own business. Keep your hands |to yourself. kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com | P.J. O'Rourke (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ [ ... ] > Robert Heinlein had several pseudonyms. Anson MacDonald wrote the > non-Future-History stories bought by editor John Campbell (who himself [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > didn't want a single writer to have more than one story in a given > issue. There's an excellent published collection of Heinlein's stories written off the main Future History sequence. It's titled, logically enough, *Off the Main Sequence*. It opens with one of the best known Anson MacDonald stories, "Solution Unsatisfactory", and ends with the inimitable "--All you Zombies--". It's available at Amazon and elsewhere -- not cheap, but it does offer more than 700 pages of prime Heinlein. The SF story that came closest to disclosing the workings of an atomic bomb (a lot closer than, say, "Solution Unsatisfactory") is "Deadline" by Cleve Cartmill. A lengthy article by Robert Silverberg covers that ground quite thoroughly. It's online at <http://www.asimovs.com/_issue_0310/ref.shtml>. "SU" is, however, a much better story. SignatureBob Lieblich Those were the days >The SF story that came closest to disclosing the workings of an atomic >bomb (a lot closer than, say, "Solution Unsatisfactory") is "Deadline" >by Cleve Cartmill. A lengthy article by Robert Silverberg covers that >ground quite thoroughly. It's online at ><http://www.asimovs.com/_issue_0310/ref.shtml>. "SU" is, however, a >much better story. Well, part one of it is, but I can't find any way of getting at the rest of it, and I don't reaaly want to subscribe to Asimov's just for that. SignatureDon Aitken Mail to the From: address is not read. To email me, substitute "clara.co.uk" for "freeuk.com" > >The SF story that came closest to disclosing the workings of an atomic > >bomb (a lot closer than, say, "Solution Unsatisfactory") is "Deadline" [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > rest of it, and I don't reaaly want to subscribe to Asimov's just for > that. <http://www.asimovs.com/_issue_0410/ref.shtml>. Also free. > > >The SF story that came closest to disclosing the workings of an atomic > > >bomb (a lot closer than, say, "Solution Unsatisfactory") is "Deadline" [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > <http://www.asimovs.com/_issue_0410/ref.shtml>. Also free. Whoops. It's <http://www.asimovs.com/_issue_0311/ref2.shtml>. Sorry. >> > >The SF story that came closest to disclosing the workings of an atomic >> > >bomb (a lot closer than, say, "Solution Unsatisfactory") is "Deadline" [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > >Whoops. It's <http://www.asimovs.com/_issue_0311/ref2.shtml>. Sorry. Thanks very much. SignatureDon Aitken Mail to the From: address is not read. To email me, substitute "clara.co.uk" for "freeuk.com" |
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