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That'll teach me not to

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Paul Wolff - 12 Jan 2007 22:02 GMT
In the cornstarch thread, in message
<1168637652.796763.127940@51g2000cwl.googlegroups.com>, Jerry Friedman
<jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> writes

>That'll teach me not to jump to conclusions.

Is the 'not' compulsory?

I know the sense demands it; but I'm sure I hear it otherwise, as in
'That'll teach him to laugh in church' when misfortune strikes.
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Paul
In bocca al Lupo!

Robert Lieblich - 12 Jan 2007 23:26 GMT
> In the cornstarch thread, in message
> <1168637652.796763.127940@51g2000cwl.googlegroups.com>, Jerry Friedman
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> I know the sense demands it; but I'm sure I hear it otherwise, as in
> 'That'll teach him to laugh in church' when misfortune strikes.

Ahh, I could care less.

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Bob Lieblich
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Fred - 13 Jan 2007 01:49 GMT
>> In the cornstarch thread, in message
>> <1168637652.796763.127940@51g2000cwl.googlegroups.com>, Jerry Friedman
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> Ahh, I could care less.

So see if you can't stop jumping to conclusions.
Ray O'Hara - 13 Jan 2007 03:04 GMT
> > In the cornstarch thread, in message
> > <1168637652.796763.127940@51g2000cwl.googlegroups.com>, Jerry Friedman
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> Ahh, I could care less.

You are interested in funny things.
Robert Lieblich - 13 Jan 2007 16:51 GMT
> > > In the cornstarch thread, in message
> > > <1168637652.796763.127940@51g2000cwl.googlegroups.com>, Jerry Friedman
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>
> You are interested in funny things.

That's what keeps me reading your posts, Ray.
Bob Cunningham - 13 Jan 2007 01:03 GMT
> In the cornstarch thread, in message
> <1168637652.796763.127940@51g2000cwl.googlegroups.com>, Jerry Friedman
> <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> writes

> >That'll teach me not to jump to conclusions.

> Is the 'not' compulsory?

> I know the sense demands it; but I'm sure I hear it otherwise, as in
> 'That'll teach him to laugh in church' when misfortune strikes.

I've heard that idiom, I've used it, and I'll use it again
whenever occasion arises.  But the pattern of stress and
intonation  has to be right to avoid reversing the meaning.

Note that even with the "not" in place, the meaning can
still be reversed with appropriate intonation and stress, as
in

     That'll teach HIM not to LAUGH at the boss's jokes.

where falling intonation on "jokes" is needed.

If the intended meaning is "He should now understand that he
must not laugh at the boss's jokes", there's a rising
intonation from "boss's" to "jokes", and the only special
stress is on "him".

To better show what I mean, I've recorded the two
statements.  You can hear them at

www.exw6sxq.com/sparky/aue_related/speech_examples/jokes_up.wav

and

www.exw6sxq.com/sparky/aue_related/speech_examples/jokes_down.wav

By the way, if I feel the urge to use the "not", I will put
it between the "to" and the infinitive, where it seems more
natural.

    That'll teach him to not laugh in church.
Snidely - 13 Jan 2007 02:39 GMT
[..]
> >That'll teach me not to jump to conclusions.
>
> Is the 'not' compulsory?

This one is straightforward:
I am learning "Don't jump to conclusions!"

> I know the sense demands it; but I'm sure I hear it otherwise, as in
> 'That'll teach him to laugh in church' when misfortune strikes.

This one is similar to learning "proof by contradiction" in math -- you
go the long way around, sorta:

I am learning "Laughing in church has consequences!"

/dps
 
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