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Discussion Groups / English Usage / January 2007Crisp vs. crispy
When I were a lad, things like pizza crusts properly done, Smith's potato crisps, the batter around deep fried fish, brandy snaps at Christmas, nicely done bacon, were said to be "crisp". More and more these days, that adjective seems to be in the process of being supplanted by the infantile "crispy". I blame advertising copyrighters I suppose. In the 1980s, or maybe earlier, Birdseye in the UK brought out a batter coated frozen fish product which, they wanted to emphasise, had a different kind of coating. They invented a new word: the product was trumpeted, in that infinitely annoying way that TV ads have, as having "Crispy CRUNKLY batter!". But I digress. Am I alone, or severely outnumbered, in hating the infantilisation of so much of the language? mike.j.har...@gmail.com wrote: > When I were a lad, things like pizza crusts properly done, Smith's > potato crisps, the batter around deep fried fish, brandy snaps at [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > severely outnumbered, in hating the infantilisation of so much of the > language? I share your distaste; but brace yourself for the counterblast from those who point out that it's been around since the seventeenth century. I don't actually think that excuses it, since I'm quite sure the marketing bods really did think they were inventing a new baby-talk word: as you know, we really like being talked to like that, and it makes us buy things. (If you want to be further affronted, check the ready-made puddings in the supermarket, and read the text on some moussey things under the brand-name "G?". I have to be guided rapidly past them by burly keepers for fear of an embarrassing scene.) Actually, I think I blame Chinese restaurants for the first British manifestation: I'm sure "crispy noodles" was the first use I spotted, back in the sixties. But they must surely have got it from marketing-speak which had escaped my notice.  SignatureMike. > (If you want to be further affronted, check the > ready-made puddings in the supermarket, and read the text on some > moussey things under the brand-name "Gü". I have to be guided rapidly > past them by burly keepers for fear of an embarrassing scene.) The Daily Telegraph Money pages interviewed the guy who dreamed them up. (I don't read the DT, I Googled for "Gu".) ...So why Gü and what does it mean? "Nothing. It's not a word at all," confesses Mr Averdieck. "But it sounds European and conjures up an image of lovely, gooey chocolate. The design and branding are distinctive and therefore stand out on the shelves in the chilled desserts section. That's of course what we want." If Gu isn't a "word", what is it? I've been to the Gü website. What a nightmare! Lots of Flash animation. Every letter u has an umlaut over it: "fün", "contact üs". Yuck. Well not quite. They missed one - "Oür puds". They have a new product - chocolate "fondü". They all look disgusting. > > (If you want to be further affronted, check the > > ready-made puddings in the supermarket, and read the text on some [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > They all look disgusting. Tell it not in Gath, but I have eaten one of their things, and it was delicious. Won't repeat it, though. SignatureMike. > Tell it not in Gath, but I have eaten one of their things, and it was > delicious. Won't repeat it, though. When my kids were growing up in the 1980s, I am afraid to admit that I grew to quite like "crunkly" batter, and "waffly versatile" potato waffles, both Birdseye products. > The Daily Telegraph Money pages interviewed the guy who dreamed them > up. (I don't read the DT, I Googled for "Gu".) [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > distinctive and therefore stand out on the shelves in the chilled > desserts section. That's of course what we want." Is "goo" not a word in BrE? Or is Mr. Averdieck not BrE? To this American, "goo" means "sloppy stuff" or "gross gunk," not "mmmm, lovely high-quality chocolate." Of course, my favorite supermarket pudding is made by Kozy Shack. So who am I to judge? SignatureSML > > The Daily Telegraph Money pages interviewed the guy who dreamed them > > up. (I don't read the DT, I Googled for "Gu".) [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > American, "goo" means "sloppy stuff" or "gross gunk," not "mmmm, lovely > high-quality chocolate." [...] Same over here, too. But I think people could use it approvingly in a limited context: "I love the gooey stuff on a treacle pudding". That's probably where the vile 'Ave-a-dick is coming from. Note that his products are rather expensive: I'm not sure how that fits in, but it's a fact. SignatureMike. > Actually, I think I blame Chinese restaurants for the first British > manifestation: I'm sure "crispy noodles" was the first use I spotted, > back in the sixties. But they must surely have got it from > marketing-speak which had escaped my notice. My first sighting, also in the sixties, was when Kentucky Fried came to town. Still, I never did trust the Colonel's grasp of language, because he also spoke of "finger-licking chicken" when everyone knows that chickens don't have tongues. Various discussions in AUE have by now convinced me that "crispy" is a perfectly normal word in the USA. Even so, it grates when advertising people export words that sound like baby-talk in the target countries. Thinking back on it, I see that the KFC advertising contained other examples of baby talk. There was, for example, a TV ad using a song that is too long for me to remember, but it was definitely targeted towards young children. By now I recall only the ending: "A drive isn't funny On an empty tummy Thank goodness for Ken; f.ck, he tried." SignaturePeter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org Please note the changed e-mail and web addresses. The domain eepjm.newcastle.edu.au no longer exists, and I can no longer receive mail at my newcastle.edu.au addresses. The optusnet address could disappear at any time. Mike Lyle ha escrito: > mike.j.har...@gmail.com wrote: > > When I were a lad, things like pizza crusts properly done, Smith's [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > -- > Mike. In 1960, "How to Talk a Good Fight" (or something like that) in _The I Hate to Cook Book_ said that one should say "crispy" instead of "crisp." There was a whole list of plebeian, pedestrian words, and the words one should use instead to convince listeners that one was actually a good cook, nearly a chef. Pan-fry instead of fry, and I don't remember the rest. Cece > When I were a lad, things like pizza crusts properly done, Smith's > potato crisps, the batter around deep fried fish, brandy snaps at [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > severely outnumbered, in hating the infantilisation of so much of the > language? Maybe you can blame us Americans. It's been "crispy" all my life (I can remember well before the '80s), at least in conversation. More adjectival. Of course, that's consistent with it being infantile. I can think of two hypocorisms that I use and consider standard: "bye" (for "good-bye") and "piggyback". SignatureJerry Friedman jerry_friedman@yahoo.com filted: >Maybe you can blame us Americans. It's been "crispy" all my life (I >can remember well before the '80s), at least in conversation. More [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >two hypocorisms that I use and consider standard: "bye" (for >"good-bye") and "piggyback". They both turn my tummy....r Signature"Keep your eye on the Bishop. I want to know when he makes his move", said the Inspector, obliquely. > jerry_friedman@yahoo.com filted: > > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > They both turn my tummy....r You could put your pinkies in your ears. SignatureMike. >> When I were a lad, things like pizza crusts properly done, Smith's >> potato crisps, the batter around deep fried fish, brandy snaps at [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > can remember well before the '80s), at least in conversation. More > adjectival. It would appear to be American from way back. The _New York Times_ goes back to 1851, and I see "the running bass of the horses' hoofs on the crispy snow" in 1852. (A context in which I would have used "crisp".) It next shows up in January, 1854, and there are 76 hits before 1900. In the _Brooklyn Daily Eagle_ (from 1841), it first shows up metaphorically in 1846: Short as pie-crust, and twice as crispy, are the remarks of the whig journals, in reference to the late Brooklyn and New York Elections. [4/30/1846] and there are 74 hits before 1900. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |Never ascribe to malice that which 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |can adequately be explained by Palo Alto, CA 94304 |stupidity. kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ [snip] > before 1900. In the _Brooklyn Daily Eagle_ (from 1841), it first > shows up metaphorically in 1846: > > Short as pie-crust, and twice as crispy, are the remarks of the > whig journals, in reference to the late Brooklyn and New York > Elections. [4/30/1846] [snip] Good researching. An 1845 sighting: http://cdl.library.cornell.edu/cgi-bin/moa/pageviewer?frames=1&coll=moa&view=50& root=%2Fmoa%2Fusde%2Fusde0016%2F&tif=00192.TIF&cite=http%3A%2F%2Fcdl.library.cor nell.edu%2Fcgi-bin%2Fmoa%2Fmoa-cgi%3Fnotisid%3DAGD1642-0016-27 First Eight Days in England, by Judge Carleton: p. 182 1 match of 'crispy' in:Title: The United States Democratic review. / Volume 16, Issue 80 February 1845 p.182 "...Her dark olive skin, crispy locks, large black eyes and snowy teeth, bore testimony of her African blood, while her nose and lips were altogether European, and her chin the termination of a perfect oval...." Aloha ~~~ Ozzie Maland ~~~ San Diego > When I were a lad, things like pizza crusts properly done, Smith's > potato crisps, the batter around deep fried fish, brandy snaps at [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > But I digress. Am I alone, or severely outnumbered, in hating the > infantilisation of so much of the language? I agree with you, though I fear we're still vastly outnumbered. I've always assumed, with no evidence whatsoever, that "cripsy" was invented (or at least resurrected) to better fit with "crunchy". A couple of more recent travesties I've noticed are "plushy" and "poshy". No doubt they're somehow superior to "plush" and "posh", but they make me sicky-wicky. SignatureRay (remove the Xs to reply) >I blame advertising > copyrighters I suppose. Of course I meant to type 'copywriters'... > >I blame advertising > > copyrighters I suppose. > > Of course I meant to type 'copywriters'... That was patent. SignatureJerry Friedman > > >I blame advertising > > > copyrighters I suppose. > > > > Of course I meant to type 'copywriters'... > > That was patent. Not, alas, to me. I thought he meant what he wrote, and was referring to the fact that copyright restrictions sometimes prevent copywriters from writing what they otherwise might. It' what comes of looking for a complicated explanation of a simple error. athel > > > >I blame advertising > > > > copyrighters I suppose. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > from writing what they otherwise might. It' what comes of looking for a > complicated explanation of a simple error. Maybe I did mean it - I mean maybe I was right when I thought I was wrong, or something. >>I blame advertising >>copyrighters I suppose. > > Of course I meant to type 'copywriters'... They would be copywrights. SignatureRob Bannister > >>I blame advertising > >>copyrighters I suppose. > > > > Of course I meant to type 'copywriters'... > > They would be copywrights. I like that! Ray wrote, in <Xns98BDBB60B53A9amfmssb@207.115.17.102> on Fri, 19 Jan 2007 23:25:08 GMT: > A couple of more recent travesties I've noticed are "plushy" and > "poshy". No doubt they're somehow superior to "plush" and "posh", but > they make me sicky-wicky. "Feather-footed through the plashy fen passes the questing vole" SignatureNick Spalding > I agree with you, though I fear we're still vastly outnumbered. I've > always assumed, with no evidence whatsoever, that "cripsy" was invented > (or at least resurrected) to better fit with "crunchy". Cripes! It's usually "Crisp'N" that goes with "crunchy" in advertising around here. SignatureRegards John for mail: my initials plus a u e at tpg dot com dot au >When I were a lad, things like pizza crusts properly done, Smith's >potato crisps, the batter around deep fried fish, brandy snaps at [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >severely outnumbered, in hating the infantilisation of so much of the >language? I've seen "crispy bacon" on restaurant menus. But I have a question about "Crunchy" Apart from the Cadbury's product, I see some American conservatives are referred to as "crunchy". Does this have anything to do with China? I remember seen taglines warning against antagonising dragons because "thou art crunchy and goest well with Brie" -- or words to that effect. SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk > Apart from the Cadbury's product, I see some American conservatives are > referred to as "crunchy". > > Does this have anything to do with China? No. It's new to me, but searching on <crunchy american conservatives> turns up immediate references to "granola" and "whole-grain" -- it's that sort of crunchy. There's a book: Crunchy Cons: How Birkenstocked Burkeans, Gun-Loving Organic Gardeners, Evangelical Free-Range Farmers, Hip Homeschooling Mamas, Right-Wing Nature Lovers, and Their Diverse Tribe of Countercultural Conservatives Plan to Save America (or At Least the Republican Party), by Rod Dreher (Hardcover - Feb 21, 2006) >I remember seen taglines warning > against antagonising dragons because "thou art crunchy and goest well with > Brie" -- or words to that effect. Even if that line had anything to do with it, which it doesn't, those aren't *Chinese* dragons, if that was your point. More the Tolkien sort. SignatureBest -- Donna Richoux >> Apart from the Cadbury's product, I see some American conservatives are >> referred to as "crunchy". [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] >Even if that line had anything to do with it, which it doesn't, those >aren't *Chinese* dragons, if that was your point. More the Tolkien sort. Well I didn't think any American cons, neo, paleo or crunchy, would be paying much attention to Wales, so China came to mind. SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk Steve Hayes ha escrito: > >> Apart from the Cadbury's product, I see some American conservatives are > >> referred to as "crunchy". [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm > E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk Tolkein dragons. "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup" is the version most often seen. Ketchup is sometimes replaced with mustard. Cece >Tolkein dragons. "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou >art crunchy and taste good with ketchup" is the version most often >seen. Ketchup is sometimes replaced with mustard. That's close, except that I remember Brie. SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk >That's close, except that I remember Brie. Ah, well, that happens to all of us. Just don't tell your wife you're thinking about an old girlfriend. SignatureTony Cooper Orlando, FL >> That's close, except that I remember Brie. > > Ah, well, that happens to all of us. Just don't tell your wife > you're thinking about an old girlfriend. Thinking is acceptable. The big no-no is calling her name out at the height of passion. SignaturePeter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org Please note the changed e-mail and web addresses. The domain eepjm.newcastle.edu.au no longer exists, and I can no longer receive mail at my newcastle.edu.au addresses. The optusnet address could disappear at any time. tony_cooper213@earthlink.net had it: > >That's close, except that I remember Brie. > > Ah, well, that happens to all of us. Just don't tell your wife you're > thinking about an old girlfriend. I had never heard "Bree" (is it spelled that way?) as a girl's name until Desperate Housewives. Is it common, and is it short for something? SignatureDavid ===== On 21 Jan 2007, the Omrud wrote > I had never heard "Bree" (is it spelled that way?) as a girl's > name until Desperate Housewives. Is it common, and is it short > for something? Sabrina, maybe? (Just guessing.) SignatureCheers, Harvey Canadian and British English, indiscriminately mixed For e-mail, change harvey.news to harvey.van > tony_cooper213@earthlink.net had it: > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > until Desperate Housewives. Is it common, and is it short for > something? In my experience it's pretty ra--- uncommon. There is one notable genuine Bree in the US: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bree_Walker>. SignatureBob Lieblich Accept no substitute Bree >tony_cooper213@earthlink.net had it: > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >until Desperate Housewives. Is it common, and is it short for >something? If past occurrences determine future occurrences, there are girl infants named both Brie and Bree in the US. Television character names are frequently picked up as real person names, and name spelling is not a constant in the US. I don't know how reliable this list is, but see: http://www.babynames.com/Names/name_display.php?n=BRIE for Brie and http://www.babynames.com/Names/name_display.php?id=857 for Bree and http://www.babynames.com/Names/name_display.php?id=6894 for Brea. SignatureTony Cooper Orlando, FL tony_cooper213@earthlink.net had it: > >tony_cooper213@earthlink.net had it: > > [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > http://www.babynames.com/Names/name_display.php?id=857 for Bree and > http://www.babynames.com/Names/name_display.php?id=6894 for Brea. Aha. Following a link on one of those pages (the rather bizzarely titled "Find a unique name for your child"), I eventually gleaned these facts (if facts they be): Irish: Diminutive form of Brianna Based on the 1990 US Census, Bree was ranked the number 2099 most popular Girls name in the US. So I looked at the UK Census and BMD records. The name has become popular in the last 15 years, presumably as part of the invasion of Celtic names which has taken place over that time. Whereas there are only 21 registrations of children with a forename of "Bree" between 1837 and 1983 (including boys with a middle name of Bree, presumably as a family surname), there are 472 registered since 1984. The 1901 census shows only two, both of them boys' middle names. SignatureDavid ===== > tony_cooper213@earthlink.net had it: > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > until Desperate Housewives. Is it common, and is it short for > something? Bob has mentioned someone whose given name seems to be "Bree". It might be short for "Brianna", which is a relatively common name in these parts. Fran [ ... ] > Bob has mentioned someone whose given name seems to be "Bree". It might > be short for "Brianna", which is a relatively common name in these parts. Add to the list of Things I Never Knew Until I Searched the Web: "Raised Patricia Lynn Nelson in Austin, Minnesota, Walker created the name 'Bree' as a word play on her father's 'Breeze Automobile Service Station' when the radio program director who first hired her in Kansas City ordered her to come up with an unusual and catchy on-air name" Source: <http://www.abilitymagazine.com/walker_interview.html>. <sigh> SignatureBob Lieblich Live and Loin > [ ... ] > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > <sigh> I didn't know that. I googled for "Bree" and found: http://www.thinkbabynames.com/meaning/0/Bree The girl's name Bree \b-ree\ is pronounced bree. It is of Irish and Gaelic origin. Anglicized form of the Irish Gaelic name Bríghe, a variant of Brighid (see Bridget). Also possibly (Latin) "from the boundary line". May also be used as a short form of Brianna and Sabrina. Jane Fonda played a call girl character named Bree in the 1971 movie "Klute". Fran fkemmish@optonline.net had it: > I googled for "Bree" and found: > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Jane Fonda played a call girl character named Bree in the 1971 movie > "Klute". I had forgotten that. I just remember her looking at her watch. But she (the character) was ahead of her time - the name was in the top 1000 in the US only between about 1960 and 1980. Mrs van de Camp/Hodge is too old to have been named after the hooker, but she probably fits into the beginning of the popularity bracket. SignatureDavid ===== >> [ ... ] >> [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > Jane Fonda played a call girl character named Bree in the 1971 movie > "Klute". And I didn't know that. I do know it was fashionable in Australia for a while. Those girls would now be in their early or middle 20s. SignatureRob Bannister >I had never heard "Bree" (is it spelled that way?) as a girl's name >until Desperate Housewives. Is it common, and is it short for >something? I only know of Bree (spelt that way) as a town in Middle Earth and a (male) horse in Narnia. SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk >>That's close, except that I remember Brie. > >Ah, well, that happens to all of us. Just don't tell your wife you're >thinking about an old girlfriend. Um, right. I supose you had one called Camembert? SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk > >>That's close, except that I remember Brie. > > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > I supose you had one called Camembert? We called her "Bert" for short. Compare Winifred = Fred. SignatureBob Lieblich My wife Sharon is NOT called Ron >> >>That's close, except that I remember Brie. >> > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >We called her "Bert" for short. Compare Winifred = Fred. Or there's Virginia - virgin for short but not for long. I'm wondering if that was another of those jokes that got some old music hall comedian thrown off the BBC in the 1950s. SignatureRobin Herts, England [...] > Or there's Virginia - virgin for short but not for long. I'm > wondering if that was another of those jokes that got some old music > hall comedian thrown off the BBC in the 1950s. I imagine they tossed him off. SignatureMike. -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com >> >>That's close, except that I remember Brie. >> > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >We called her "Bert" for short. Compare Winifred = Fred. And Frederick - Rick Right said Fred SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk > Tolkein dragons. "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou > art crunchy and taste good with ketchup" is the version most often > seen. Ketchup is sometimes replaced with mustard. The Tolkien line was something like, "Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are [something] and quick to anger." ...Now I've looked it up. "Subtle." "Two Towers: BOOK III - Chapter 11" "Pippin my lad [said Merry], don't forget Gildor's saying - the one Sam used to quote: Do not meddle in the affairs of Wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." "But our whole life for months has been one long meddling in affairs of Wizards," said Pippin. The dragon joke had to be modelled after this. SignatureBest -- Donna Richoux >> Tolkein dragons. "Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for >> thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup" is the version most [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > The dragon joke had to be modelled after this. The canonical one I remember was the crossing over between that and Do not throw cigarette butts in the urinal: It makes them soggy and hard to light. Producing both Do not throw cigarette butts in the urinal, For they are subtle and quick to anger. and Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards: It makes them soggy and hard to light. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |ActiveX is pretty harmless anyway. 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |It can't affect you unless you Palo Alto, CA 94304 |install Windows, and who would be |foolish enough to do that? kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com | Peter Moylan (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ > But I have a question about "Crunchy" > > Apart from the Cadbury's product, I think you mean "Crunchie". I don't really think of it as a Cadbury's product - that just shows how old I am. Fran > > But I have a question about "Crunchy" > > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Fran As a student in the early 1970s I used to work summers "Down Fry's", as Bristolians used to put it, at Somerdale, near Keynsham. One remedy for boredom practised by the workers was to hold contests to see who could spit furthest into the vats of molten chocolate which were to be used for enrobing the confectionery bars. Another was to find funny items to throw into the vat. Dead mice were prized, as were pigeons, sparrows, cigarette ends, condoms, and used band-aids. As you can deduce, morale was low. The managers were a right shower of sh*te. >>>But I have a question about "Crunchy" >>> [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > cigarette ends, condoms, and used band-aids. As you can deduce, morale > was low. The managers were a right shower of sh*te. When I was a student in the late 1960s, I worked at Cadbury's in Bournville. We didn't find it necessary to throw anything disgusting in the chocolate (not that women were allowed near anything like molten chocolate in those days, anyway). I couldn't eat chocolate for years afterwards. Morale was certainly low. I worked for a while check-weighing chocolate novelties. The best part of the day was when we pulled the cord that stopped the line, because the pieces didn't meet the standard. I had some Cadbury's chocolate from Australia yesterday - tasted good. Fran >When I was a student in the late 1960s, I worked at Cadbury's in >Bournville. We didn't find it necessary to throw anything disgusting in >the chocolate (not that women were allowed near anything like molten >chocolate in those days, anyway). I couldn't eat chocolate for years >afterwards. What a small world. I also worked there but more like in the early 60's some time. I worked for the British Tabulating Machine Company (or was it ICT by then?) and Messr's Cadbury were a customer of ours where I was seconded to look after their punched card kit for a while. I remember that there was a rule whereby you were not allowed to take any "samples" home with you, but you were free (nay - encouraged) to eat as much as you wanted on the premises. This had the salutory effect of making you sick of the stuff in very short order, and thus disinclined to break any rules about pocketing the stuff to take home. Jitze >>When I was a student in the late 1960s, I worked at Cadbury's in >>Bournville. We didn't find it necessary to throw anything disgusting in [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > disinclined to break any rules about pocketing the stuff > to take home. In my case, it was the all-pervading smell of chocolate that put me off. I ate hardly any, even on the first day that I worked there, because as soon as I bit into it, the taste and smell combined to make me feel sick. We were able to buy things very cheaply in the factory shop. I bought cakes and biscuits for my friends and landlady, but I didn't get anything for myself. Fran > In my case, it was the all-pervading smell of chocolate that put me off. > I ate hardly any, even on the first day that I worked there, because as > soon as I bit into it, the taste and smell combined to make me feel sick. Truly. Reminds me of when I resided in my second/third apartment in Chicago (TLCIA), which was I think around the northwest fringes of the Near North. It was close enough to where I worked that I could walk from the office to my residence, but the air along the route was filled with a sickeningly strong smell of chocolate cake. Evidently, there was a chocolate cake mix factory not far from there. To this day, I cannot eat chocolate cake. SignatureSalvatore Volatile couperus-eschew-this@znet.com had it: > What a small world. I also worked there but more like in the > early 60's some time. I worked for the British Tabulating Machine [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > disinclined to break any rules about pocketing the stuff > to take home. I worked at a fruit freezing plant during one summer holiday. They had a similar rule, which worked fine for gooseberries, blackcurrants, raspberries and plums. But the plan to make us at least fed up failed when it came to strawberries. It is not in me to have had enough strawberries. SignatureDavid ===== In alt.usage.english, mike j harvey wrote: >As a student in the early 1970s I used to work summers "Down Fry's", as >Bristolians used to put it, at Somerdale, near Keynsham. One remedy for [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >cigarette ends, condoms, and used band-aids. As you can deduce, morale >was low. The managers were a right shower of sh*te. I'm sure they were but management didn't need to shite in the '70s to get that sort of behaviour from the workforce. It was just the '70s themselves working their '70s magic, possibly through the brain-battering agency of the greasy mullet, possibly through the aggression induced by Watney's Red Barrel, but quite possibly through something innate in the decade itself. SignatureV In alt.usage.english, Vinny Burgoo wrote: >I'm sure they were but management didn't need to shite in the '70s Er, *be* shite. HM the Queen (who didn't need to sh.t in the '70s - possibly still doesn't) would be the first to tell you that both management and workers did quite a lot of shiting. SignatureV > In alt.usage.english, Vinny Burgoo wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > possibly still doesn't) would be the first to tell you that both > management and workers did quite a lot of shiting. Speaking of whom, can one of you ex-Cadburys employees confirm or deny the rumour that the factory had a "special" vat of extra-smooth chocolate constantly on the go for Her Majesty (by Royal Appointment, and all that) ? I remember being told that the students took extra care to spit into that one, but it may just be an urban myth. Mike M >>In alt.usage.english, Vinny Burgoo wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > I remember being told that the students took extra care to spit into > that one, but it may just be an urban myth. As I said before, I wouldn't know what happened to the vats of chocolate, since women weren't allowed to work with them. There was a special part of the factory that was used to give tours to the public. It had nice new linoleum on the floor. I don't know much more about it, since I only saw that when I went on a public tour. Fran >> > But I have a question about "Crunchy" >> > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >cigarette ends, condoms, and used band-aids. As you can deduce, morale >was low. The managers were a right shower of sh*te. Things must have changed since OldBloke's mum worked there then, or she wouldn't have bought Fry's chocolates for the family. SignatureLinz Wet Yorks via Cambridge, York, London and Watford My accent may vary >> But I have a question about "Crunchy" >> >> Apart from the Cadbury's product, > > I think you mean "Crunchie". I don't really think of it as a Cadbury's > product - that just shows how old I am. There's a handy mnemonic for Steve: Fry's Crunchie. Fries are crunchy. -only one 'y' in each. SignatureRegards John for mail: my initials plus a u e at tpg dot com dot au >> I think you mean "Crunchie". I don't really think of it as a Cadbury's >> product - that just shows how old I am. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >Fries are crunchy. > -only one 'y' in each. Next time I'm in a shop that sells them, I'll look for one, but I think here they are made by Cadbury-Fry's. SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk >>There's a handy mnemonic for Steve: >>Fry's Crunchie. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > here > they are made by Cadbury-Fry's. Isn't it now something like Cadbury-Fry-Pascall-MacRobertson-Rowntree-RedTulip-ChupaChups-Schweppes? There probably aren't many other brands left, and those all belong to either Nestle or Mars. SignatureRegards John for mail: my initials plus a u e at tpg dot com dot au John Holmes filted: >Isn't it now something like >Cadbury-Fry-Pascall-MacRobertson-Rowntree-RedTulip-ChupaChups-Schweppes? >There probably aren't many other brands left, and those all belong to either >Nestle or Mars. Which of those is Hershey?...r Signature"You got Schadenfreude on my Weltanshauung!" "You got Weltanschauung in my Schadenfreude!" dadoctah@spamcop.net had it: > John Holmes filted: > > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Which of those is Hershey?...r They don't make chocolate though. SignatureDavid ===== the Omrud filted: >dadoctah@spamcop.net had it: >> >> Which of those is Hershey?...r > >They don't make chocolate though. Until you start drinking this stuff, don't talk to me about chocolate: http://www.thenibble.com/reviews/main/chocolate/images/ibarra-150.jpg ....r Signature"You got Schadenfreude on my Weltanshauung!" "You got Weltanschauung in my Schadenfreude!" > dadoctah@spamcop.net had it: > > > > Which of those is Hershey?...r > > They don't make chocolate though. As a small British kid in the 1960s, Hershey bars were one of those exotic things that I saw advertised in American comics, and craved (along with Tootsie rolls, whatever *they* were). I finally got to try some Hershey's chocolate a couple of years ago. It tasted like sick. Mike M >> dadoctah@spamcop.net had it: >> > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >I finally got to try some Hershey's chocolate a couple of years ago. It >tasted like sick. Have you tried a Tootsie roll? They taste sick that's gone off. Other objects of Brit-kid desire that turned out to be terrible disappointments include Oreos (throat-cloggingly dry creme-filled biscuits, er no thanks, I'll stick to me Jaffa Cakes) and M&Ms (toxically shiny Smarties). SignatureArchie Valparaiso (Me? I blame the weather.) gguiri@yahoo.com had it: > >> dadoctah@spamcop.net had it: > >> > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Have you tried a Tootsie roll? They taste sick that's gone off. It was, I am sure, the Tootsie Roll advert in the back of the Superman comics which went something like "Bar Candy, bah. Bag Candy, bleugh. Get Tootsie Roll." We were even excited by the exotic names "bar candy" and "bag candy". As has been discussed here before, I am rather partial to Tootsie Roll and bring some home each time I visit the USA. OTOH, my children threw away a Hershey bar after tasting one square each. Mind, even Kit Kat has been reformulated to remove the flavour for the benefit of the US market. SignatureDavid ===== >As has been discussed here before, I am rather partial to Tootsie >Roll and bring some home each time I visit the USA. The only thing I used to bring back was Pepto-Bismol but that's been available here for some tome now. My son always asked for grape soda, but that was too heavy. >>>dadoctah@spamcop.net had it: >>> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Have you tried a Tootsie roll? They taste sick that's gone off. I once broke a tooth eating a Tootsie Roll. > Other objects of Brit-kid desire that turned out to be terrible > disappointments include Oreos (throat-cloggingly dry creme-filled > biscuits, er no thanks, I'll stick to me Jaffa Cakes) and M&Ms > (toxically shiny Smarties). My young Australian friend brought me Smarties and Cadburys chocolate back from Australia. You can buy Cadburys chocolate in the US, but it's made by Hershey, and tastes awful. The Australian chocolate was good. The Smarties were wonderful. Her American friends hated the Smarties, but love M&Ms. Fran >>>As a small British kid in the 1960s, Hershey bars were one of those >>>exotic things that I saw advertised in American comics, and craved [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > good. The Smarties were wonderful. Her American friends hated the > Smarties, but love M&Ms. I first had a sample of Cadbury's in the '50s and found it exotic and wonderful (and also very expensive). I think it was from UK, as one of the ways to get dollars flowing into England, instead of it all going to the Marshall Plan (France and Germany). Quite some time later I was able to afford it, but the price was closer to the US price. By that time, I was given to understand that Cadbury's was being manufactured in Canada. Oh, and the taste wasn't nearly as exotic. Probably that was at about the time when Kraft started making Marmite. >Archie Valparaiso wrote: >> >> Have you tried a Tootsie roll? They taste sick that's gone off. > >I once broke a tooth eating a Tootsie Roll. Oh dear me - you are complaining about a wimpy Tootsie Toll causing dental fracture. This from somebody living in the land that brought you Callard & Bowser's Toffee. Now *there* was something to be reckoned with in terms of testing the choppers to their limits! Incidentally, Rightpondian "toffee" is not to be confused with Leftpondian "taffy" although they probably both derive from the same ur-confection. (Having tossed that grenade into the discussion I shall now raise my shields and sit back...) Jitze >>Archie Valparaiso wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > was something to be reckoned with in terms of testing the > choppers to their limits! I don't live in the land of Callard and Bowser; I live in Connecticut. > Incidentally, Rightpondian "toffee" is not to be confused > with Leftpondian "taffy" although they probably both derive > from the same ur-confection. Suchard, which owned C&B, has decided to end UK production of all Callard and Bowser products. I'm sure you can still get Thornton's Special Toffee though. Last time I was in England, I ate a Quality Street toffee, and popped off the bridgework which had replaced the tooth which the tootsie roll broke. Fran > Last time I was in England, I ate a Quality Street toffee, and popped > off the bridgework which had replaced the tooth which the tootsie roll > broke. Well, if you choose to live so dangerously... SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) >> Last time I was in England, I ate a Quality Street toffee, and popped >> off the bridgework which had replaced the tooth which the tootsie roll >> broke. > > Well, if you choose to live so dangerously... I was overtaken by a wave of nostalgia. It won't happen again. Fran >>> Last time I was in England, I ate a Quality Street toffee, and >>> popped off the bridgework which had replaced the tooth which the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > I was overtaken by a wave of nostalgia. It won't happen again. I think that the "Heath Bar" came to the US from England. It was marketed as "toffee". I don't look at candy-bar shelves in stores any more, but nowadays I see that some ice-creams are made with "toffee bits" and others are made using "Heath Bars". You know, like "cookie dough" or "Oreo cookie" ice cream. But we had "butter brickle" flavor before the names got all fancy. I expect that was made from "toffee bits". > I think that the "Heath Bar" came to the US from England. It was > marketed as "toffee". As a lifetime UK resident, I had never heard of the "Heath Bar", but this page tells the story: http://www.hersheys.com/products/details/heath.asp Apparently it's an (English toffee) bar, rather than an (English) toffee bar. Like Chicago "pizza", it's US through and through. SignatureWH > Apparently it's an (English toffee) bar, rather than an (English) > toffee bar. Like Chicago "pizza", it's US through and through. Hey, don't place the blame for Chicago "pizza" on the shoulders of the entire country. SignatureSalvatore Volatile fkemmish@optonline.net had it: > Suchard, which owned C&B, has decided to end UK production of all > Callard and Bowser products. I'm sure you can still get Thornton's > Special Toffee though. The toffee's the same, but the presentation is changed. No longer is there a large sheet of toffee in a tray which the assistant could break up with a hammer. It's all pre-packed in packets and boxes these days. On the positive side, Thorntons now has far more shops - there is one in most towns. And some of their products can be found in other outlets including some supermarkets. SignatureDavid ===== > fkemmish@optonline.net had it: > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > break up with a hammer. It's all pre-packed in packets and boxes > these days. About five years ago, Thorntons sold a version of the tray and hammer toffee, which I brought back to the US for a Swedish friend. I think it was in honour of some anniversary or other. > On the positive side, Thorntons now has far more shops - there is one > in most towns. And some of their products can be found in other > outlets including some supermarkets. They also have some cafés. When I was packing up my mother's stuff after she went into a nursing home, I took coffee breaks at the Thorntons nearby. I was disappointed to find, later, that they are not a feature of most Thorntons shops. Fran >fkemmish@optonline.net had it: > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >in most towns. And some of their products can be found in other >outlets including some supermarkets. Not sure if it was Thornton's or another make, but lemme tell ya about a learning experience I once had with a bar of same. Said bar was a slab of maybe 4 by 6 inches and half an inch thick, wrapped in cellophane. I grabbed this bar for standby emergency victuals just before taking off in a light aircraft for a flight into the reaches of the northern Kenya desert and stuffed it into the back pocket of my shorts. Ensued a 4 hour flight in a baking cockpit with sun blazing through canopy and me sitting in a pool of sweat. On disembarking I find out that said toffee has melted and oozed through the cellophane to saturate the shorts and underwear on which I am sitting, even unto running down the back of my thigh. Garments are now well and truly adhered to bum and back of leg - the latter being adorned with a modicum of hair. Oh the pain! Eventualy I ended up sitting in a local river (muddy trickle actualy) for some hours until it had all dissolved and I could remove and then refresh my vestments with a clean pair. Dang that hurt! Jitze >I don't live in the land of Callard and Bowser; I live in Connecticut. Ooops - my bad. Brain not in gear. Conclusion unwarrantedly jumping. Mustn't do that. Excuse - I can never remember a name but will always forget a face. Senior moment or something. Jitze > >I once broke a tooth eating a Tootsie Roll. > > Oh dear me - you are complaining about a wimpy Tootsie Toll > causing dental fracture. I once broke a tooth eating lentils, which seems very wimpy indeed. Not only that, but I think I did it right before the only boink I've attended -- I remember I had a toothache, and I left early because of it. _And_ I sat next to Fran at the boink. Ahhh, the circle of life... or something. SignatureSML [...] >My young Australian friend brought me Smarties and Cadburys chocolate >back from Australia. You can buy Cadburys chocolate in the US, but it's >made by Hershey, and tastes awful. The Australian chocolate was good. >The Smarties were wonderful. Her American friends hated the Smarties, >but love M&Ms. Caramello koalas were quite a hit in the US when a friend, a jobbing teacher, brought some over with her. http://www.cadbury.com.au/sites/cadbury/index.php?pageId=81 SignatureRichard Bollard Canberra Australia To email, I'm at AMT not spAMT. > Have you tried a Tootsie roll? They taste sick that's gone off. > > Other objects of Brit-kid desire that turned out to be terrible > disappointments include Oreos (throat-cloggingly dry creme-filled > biscuits, er no thanks, I'll stick to me Jaffa Cakes) and M&Ms > (toxically shiny Smarties). Just thought of another one: root beer. Thought it would taste like dandelion & burdock; it didn't. Took a long time to get the taste out of my mouth. (Yes, I know we've discussed this one before). Mike M > John Holmes filted: >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >>either >>Nestle or Mars. I forgot Hoadleys from the Cadbury stable. > Which of those is Hershey?...r Never heard of that one. SignatureRegards John for mail: my initials plus a u e at tpg dot com dot au hayesmstw@hotmail.com had it: > >> I think you mean "Crunchie". I don't really think of it as a Cadbury's > >> product - that just shows how old I am. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Next time I'm in a shop that sells them, I'll look for one, but I think here > they are made by Cadbury-Fry's. Fry's was taken over by Cadbury's in the early 20th century although some chocolates retained the Fry's name in the UK for many decades (e.g. Turkish Delight, Chocolate Cream). The business is now part of the Anglo-Swiss conglomerate Cadbury Schwepps. The Crunchie was originally a Fry's product but it's been branded as Cadbury's for as long as I can remember. SignatureDavid ===== > When I were a lad, things like pizza crusts properly done, Smith's > potato crisps, the batter around deep fried fish, brandy snaps at > Christmas, nicely done bacon, were said to be "crisp". More and more > these days, that adjective seems to be in the process of being > supplanted by the infantile "crispy". And then Bart Simpson hawks "crisp-ity, crunch-ity Butterfinger candy bars". > I blame advertising copyrighters I suppose. Personally, I'd blame the copywriters instead. -- Stefano "No matter where you go, there you are. But your luggage is in Bottle Hollow, Utah." > > I blame advertising copyrighters I suppose. > > Personally, I'd blame the copywriters instead. Read back, I corrected that yesterday! |
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