whichever
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Sara Lorimer - 20 Jan 2007 21:42 GMT Is it appropriate to use "whichever" when there are only two choices? For example: "You can wear the red socks or the blue socks. You'll have to wear the black sandals, whichever socks you choose."
It sounds odd to me, but I might just be overthinking it.
 Signature SML
d.flint1@gmail.com - 20 Jan 2007 22:09 GMT Hi Sara,
I may be incorrect; however, whichever is not the best grammar usage for written use. Verbal usage is more flexible.
> Is it appropriate to use "whichever" when there are only two choices? > For example: "You can wear the red socks or the blue socks. You'll have [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > -- > SML tinwhistler - 20 Jan 2007 23:13 GMT [snip]
> I may be incorrect; however, whichever is not the best grammar usage > for written use. Verbal usage is more flexible. [snip]
These citations from OED2 would seem to support the usage even in formal writing:
1754 in Nairne Peerage Evid. (1874) 48 Upon their attaining their respective ages of eighteen years compleat or their being lawfully married whichever of these events should first happen. 1802 M. Edgeworth Moral T., Forester xi, At a walk, trot, or gallop, whichever you please. 1844 Alb. Smith Adv. Mr. Ledbury xlii, They were..permitted to go whichever way they chose. 1872 Black Adv. Phaeton x. 145 To dinner-or supper, whichever it ought to be called. 1880 Hardy Trumpet-Major I. ix. 178 Whichever of us she likes best, he shall take her home. 1911 Act 1 & 2 Geo. V c. 46 ?16 (1) Copyright shall subsist during the life of the author who first dies and for a term of fifty years after his death, or during the life of the author who dies last, whichever period is the longer. 1919 G. B. Shaw Inca of Perusalem in Heartbreak House 205 The Inca is to come and look at me, and pick out whichever of his sons he thinks will suit.
Aloha ~~~ Ozzie Maland ~~~ San Diego
Purl Gurl - 20 Jan 2007 22:59 GMT > Is it appropriate to use "whichever" when there are only two choices? Yes, acceptably appropriate.
In usage, a tendency is to use "either" for a selection amongst two things. Usage of "whichever" tends to be a selection amongst more than two things.
Ignoring tendencies, an "either" construct falls apart when subjected to many case examples, more specifically when presented with two plural groups.
Sara, I have for you a black evening gown, black high heels, a diamond necklace, a diamond bracelet and appropriate matching undergarments. I also have for you a light flower patterned yellow summer dress, pastel yellow pumps, several silver rings, an engraved silver bracelet but no color matching undergarments, for this warm summer night.
Select either outfit as you please, to wear. Whichever outfit pleases you, wear.
Usage of "either" becomes near insulting. Either limits your selection to black for the evening, or to yellow for the evening; one combination or the other combination. My offer is also to instruct you to wear this or wear that; a dictate.
"Whichever" presents polite options. You are free to wear one color theme or the other, and free to mix and match, by subtle inference; freedom of choice.
Many would choose to use "whatever" in place of "whichever." However, "whatever" references an unknown, singular or plural. "What" signals an interrogative sense, or signals unknowns might be included. Whatever does not work well because many known items are offered, but no unknown items are offered.
Of course, in practice, an offer of this nature would be presented differently. A shortened example,
"I have these dresses, these shoes, this jewelry, this and that, "which" would you like to wear?"
Readers can sense the subtle nature of "whichever" in my sentence construct immediately above. "Which" signals a clear freedom of choice. "Whichever" signals equally.
"Either," no, there is a lack of freedom of choice.
Rather subtle, yes?
Of course there are those who choose to use "whichever" simply to retain attention or for musical alliteration, amongst other clever contructs and devious devices.
Personally, I would select the black evening gown, hopefully low cut front and back, silver rings for my toes, no shoes and no undergarments.
Purl Gurl
Robert Bannister - 20 Jan 2007 23:13 GMT > Is it appropriate to use "whichever" when there are only two choices? > For example: "You can wear the red socks or the blue socks. You'll have > to wear the black sandals, whichever socks you choose." > > It sounds odd to me, but I might just be overthinking it. I confess the "whichever" makes me think it covers green and purple socks too, as well as the choices mentioned. On the hand, any other way of putting it would be a lot longer and clumsier.
 Signature Rob Bannister
Jeffrey Turner - 21 Jan 2007 00:13 GMT >> Is it appropriate to use "whichever" when there are only two choices? >> For example: "You can wear the red socks or the blue socks. You'll have >> to wear the black sandals, whichever socks you choose." >> >> It sounds odd to me, but I might just be overthinking it. If you can accept socks with sandals, you can accept "whichever" for two options.
> I confess the "whichever" makes me think it covers green and purple > socks too, as well as the choices mentioned. On the hand, any other way > of putting it would be a lot longer and clumsier. "...But you['ll] have to wear sandals [with either | in either case]."
--Jeff
 Signature The shepherd always tries to persuade the sheep that their interests and his own are the same. --Stendhal
sage - 21 Jan 2007 02:12 GMT >>> Is it appropriate to use "whichever" when there are only two choices? >>> For example: "You can wear the red socks or the blue socks. You'll have [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > --Jeff To which the reply might be "Whaaadeverrrr."
Cheers, Sage
Bob Cunningham - 21 Jan 2007 00:35 GMT > > Is it appropriate to use "whichever" when there are only two choices? > > For example: "You can wear the red socks or the blue socks. You'll have [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > socks too, as well as the choices mentioned. On the hand, any other way > of putting it would be a lot longer and clumsier. "Whichever" is okay by me for two alternatives, and the examples in the _New Shorter Oxford English Dictionary_ imply that it has been used for any number, including two.
1 M. ROBERTS They shout for her from whichever room they happen to be in.
Today 75 per cent on a small packet or £1..a gross, whichever is the greater.
2 SWIFT Both Sides hang out their Trophies too, which ever comes by the worst.
W. BESANT In politics you are used
You get nothing, whichever side is in.
'Tother pondside, _Merriam-Webster's Unabridged Dictionary_ has examples that support two and more than two.
<would like to speak to your father or your mother, whichever is at home>
<take two of the four elective subjects, whichever you prefer> <enter law or some other profession, but whichever you choose, put your whole heart into it>
Prai Jei - 21 Jan 2007 11:25 GMT Sara Lorimer (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message <1hs8rd6.pc4l5c1q2notgN%que.sara.saraDELETE@gmail.com>:
> Is it appropriate to use "whichever" when there are only two choices? > For example: "You can wear the red socks or the blue socks. You'll have > to wear the black sandals, whichever socks you choose." > > It sounds odd to me, but I might just be overthinking it. Here in South Wales (at least) we would use the expression "either way" to express independence of a choice from two: < For example: "You can wear the red socks or the blue socks. You'll have < to wear the black sandals either way."
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Interchange the alphabetic letter groups to reply
the Omrud - 21 Jan 2007 11:24 GMT pvstownsend@zyx-abc.fsnet.co.uk had it:
> Sara Lorimer (or somebody else of the same name) wrote thusly in message > <1hs8rd6.pc4l5c1q2notgN%que.sara.saraDELETE@gmail.com>: [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > < For example: "You can wear the red socks or the blue socks. You'll have > < to wear the black sandals either way." Not just a choice - I think it's more of a fact. There's the "real" meaning of "way":
- You can get to Edinburgh by catching the 12:00 train via Glasgow or the 13:00 via York. Either way, you won't arrive until 16:00.
or the analogous:
- You can hand in your homework today or tomorrow. Either way, you won't get your marks until Monday.
 Signature David =====
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