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Discussion Groups / English Usage / January 2004Caring Less
A bizarre construction in a TV review in the Mirror http://www.mirror.co.uk/entertainment/shelleyonthetelly/ (Don't read if you intend to watch Tom Conti in 'Donovan' << It would be good if the twist in part two was that Donovan actually did it. Instead it looks as if not only has he been framed but whoever framed him made it look as if Donovan had framed his son into the bargain: seriously clever and just about plausible. The problem was caring less either way.>> -- John Dean Oxford De-frag to reply "John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote on 07 Jan 2004: > A bizarre construction in a TV review in the Mirror > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > The problem was caring less either way.>> The final sentence is no problem, but the previous two are awful, IMHO. The tenses are twisted and confusing in the first: I can't tell whether the reviewer has actually seen Part II or not. The word order in the second sentence seems awkward to me.  SignatureFranke: EFL teacher & medical editor. > "John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote on 07 Jan 2004: > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > The final sentence is no problem, Really? What does 'caring less either way' look like then? -- John Dean Oxford De-frag to reply > > "John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote on 07 Jan 2004: > > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Really? What does 'caring less either way' look like then? Obviously it is derived from "could care less" or "couldn't care less." Either way. Intuitively obvious. Or maybe that's not it. I have a problem caring less either way. -- rzed >> >> The problem was caring less either way.>> >> > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >Or maybe that's not it. I have a problem caring less either way. The problem is not the caring less. The problem is the problem, or rather the problem is that it is not clear what the problem is. How can "caring less either way" be a problem? What is the speaker's problem? Is it that he cares less either way, and would prefer to care more about one or both alternatives? Or is the problem that he cares too much either way and wants to care less about one or both altetrnatives? The problem is knowing what the problem is. SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa http://www.geocities.com/Athens/7734/stevesig.htm E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk > >> >> The problem was caring less either way.>> > >> > [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > The problem is knowing what the problem is. It's not the writer's problem, exactly. (Well, the writer's sentence is problematic, but that's not the issue at hand.) The writer is reviewing a TV program, and is asserting that its viewers (if they react as the writer did) just don't care about Donovan enough to be concerned about his situation. The problem is with the production. <quote from-msg-by="John Dean"> > >> << It would be good if the twist in part two was that Donovan > >> actually did it. Instead it looks as if not only has he been [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >> > >> The problem was caring less either way.>> </quote> "John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote on 07 Jan 2004: >> "John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote on 07 Jan 2004: >> [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Really? What does 'caring less either way' look like then? It looks like a short form of "The problem that I had with 'Donovan' was caring about whether the twist in part two was seriously clever and just about plausible or just plain contrived. This made-for-TV movie isn't acted or plotted well enough to bother watching unless you're handcuffed to the sofa and can neither turn off the TV nor change the channel because the remote is broken". As rzed pointed out, "Obviously it is derived from 'could care less' or 'couldn't care less.' Either way. Intuitively obvious." I couldn't agree more. SignatureFranke: EFL teacher & medical editor. > > "John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote on 07 Jan 2004: > > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > Really? What does 'caring less either way' look like then? If you "could not care less either way", doesn't that say that your interest in either stated set of circumstances or outcomes is zero? (since any interest in either circumstance would imply the possibility of less interest than that which you currently hold). I think "could care less" is ambiguous. It's used as if it conveys the above idea, but clearly, if one COULD care less, one cares at a minimum, more than zero. Perhaps the idea is to use understatement rather than hyperbole to invite the idea. eg "Bush is ahead in the polls!" -- Yawn ... "Gosh that's interesting! (snicker)Let me see ... I suppose I could care less." I think I'd just stop at the yawn in that example though. FRAN > > > "John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote on 07 Jan 2004: > > > > > >> A bizarre construction in a TV review in the Mirror [...] > > >> The problem was caring less either way.>> > > > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > (since any interest in either circumstance would imply the possibility > of less interest than that which you currently hold). [...] I assume that Fran means "The problem was caring" means "I had difficulty in caring", which here means "I couldn't care". So the whole sentence makes perfect sense. Mike. > > > > "John Dean" <john-dean@frag.lineone.net> wrote on 07 Jan 2004: > > > > [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Mike. Someone else said that the final sentence was no problem. I was just trying to quantify the "care factor" in each phrase. If the phrase is: "I could care less" -- then presumably, there is some quantity, implicitly, but not necessarily, small. As I said, it could be an attempt at understatement. On the other hand, if it is: "I couldn't care less" then clearly, the "care factor" must be zero, (or as close to zero as the speaker can get) since the speaker is incapable of less care. A variation is "I could hardly care less", in which "hardly" emphasises the impossibility of caring less, and is thus the same as "not" in this context. FRAN |
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