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Discussion Groups / English Usage / December 2008Knock him
Hello: What kind of stroke would be involved here in "you'k knock him on his a.s" A punch or what? Does it mean "you'd knock him down so he'd fall on his a.s?" --- A guy made you this angry, you'k knock him on his a.s, and if he got up, you'd go at it. Later, you'd shake hands and it'd be over. Richard Russo, Empire Falls, p. 187 ---- Thanks. Marius Hancu > Hello: > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > A guy made you this angry, you'k knock him on his a.s, and if he got > up, you'd go at it. Later, you'd shake hands and it'd be over. It doesn't specify - you've caused him to fall over, but it doesn't say how.  SignatureDavid > Hello: > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Does it mean > "you'd knock him down so he'd fall on his a.s?" Yes. Take your choice from an uppercut, a left-hook etc. >Hello: > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >Richard Russo, Empire Falls, p. 187 >---- It really doesn't mean that anyone falls down. It means that a punch, or punches, will be delivered. If the punches are delivered with sufficient force to cause pain or injury, the action qualifies as knocking someone on their a.s. The method of the delivery of the punch - uppercut, jab, roundhouse, etc - is irrelevant. SignatureTony Cooper - Orlando, Florida > >A guy made you this angry, you'k knock him on his a.s, and if he got > >up, you'd go at it. Later, you'd shake hands and it'd be over. > It really doesn't mean that anyone falls down. It means that a punch, > or punches, will be delivered. If the punches are delivered with > sufficient force to cause pain or injury, the action qualifies as > knocking someone on their a.s. The method of the delivery of the > punch - uppercut, jab, roundhouse, etc - is irrelevant. Interesting take. Thank you all. Marius Hancu >> Hello: >> [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > sufficient force to cause pain or injury, the action qualifies as > knocking someone on their a.s. Really? In my very limited experience, BrE would require somebody to fall to the ground before "on his arse" were invoked. SignatureDavid >>> Hello: >>> [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] >Really? In my very limited experience, BrE would require somebody to >fall to the ground before "on his arse" were invoked. In my experience, it's like "being knocked for a loop" or "I kicked his a.s" or "I punched him out" or "he fell a.s over teakettle" or "I'll bust your a.s" or any of the other sayings that do not mean literally what is said. It conveys that some serious hurt was done, but the final position of the attacked is not the point. SignatureTony Cooper - Orlando, Florida >>>> What kind of stroke would be involved here in >>>> "you'k knock him on his a.s" >>>> A punch or what? >>>> Does it mean >>>> "you'd knock him down so he'd fall on his a.s?" In this case, roughly, yes. You would hit him from the front, so that he fell backwards. I'm with Tony as far as the precise position is concerned: maybe he wouldn't land sitting down. >>>> A guy made you this angry, you'k knock him on his a.s, and if he >>>> got up, you'd go at it. Later, you'd shake hands and it'd be >>>> over. >>>> Richard Russo, Empire Falls, p. 187 >>> It really doesn't mean that anyone falls down. It means that a >>> punch, or punches, will be delivered. If the punches are >>> delivered with sufficient force to cause pain or injury, the >>> action qualifies as knocking someone on their a.s. >> Really? In my very limited experience, BrE would require somebody >> to fall to the ground before "on his arse" were invoked. > In my experience, it's like "being knocked for a loop" or "I kicked > his a.s" or "I punched him out" or "he fell a.s over teakettle" or > "I'll bust your a.s" or any of the other sayings that do not mean > literally what is said. It conveys that some serious hurt was done, > but the final position of the attacked is not the point. In this case, the passage continues "if he got up, you'd go at it"; so the chances are good you knocked him to the ground. CDB filted: >>>>> Does it mean >>>>> "you'd knock him down so he'd fall on his a.s?" > >In this case, roughly, yes. You would hit him from the front, so that >he fell backwards. I'm with Tony as far as the precise position is >concerned: maybe he wouldn't land sitting down. If someone falls backwards, he may be accident prone, but if he falls the other way, there is no accident....r Signature"You got Schadenfreude on my Weltanschauung!" "You got Weltanschauung in my Schadenfreude!" > CDB filted: >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >> that he fell backwards. I'm with Tony as far as the precise >> position is concerned: maybe he wouldn't land sitting down. > If someone falls backwards, he may be accident prone, but if he > falls the other way, there is no accident....r That sounds like a quotation from a sage. Confucius or Carlin, say? It's been icy around here lately, and I have gotten into some heavy falling on my daily walks: prone, supine and loungewise. No deliberation is involved -- each occasion comes as a diverting surprise -- but the prone landing was the the only one to involve both damage and humiliation; so perhaps it was the most accidental. [...] >> If someone falls backwards, he may be accident prone, but if he >> falls the other way, there is no accident....r [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > surprise -- but the prone landing was the the only one to involve both > damage and humiliation; so perhaps it was the most accidental. I fainted at a bus stop over thirty years ago, and went straight down on my face: I still have the scars on my upper lip, nose, and forehead. Seemed accidental to me. SignatureMike. > [...] >>> If someone falls backwards, he may be accident prone, but if he [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > my face: I still have the scars on my upper lip, nose, and forehead. > Seemed accidental to me. Was the bus on time? SignatureDavid >> [...] >>>> If someone falls backwards, he may be accident prone, but if he [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Was the bus on time? That might have been sufficient cause for swooning. But I don't know, as I was either still insensible or on my way to hospital when it did arrive. My memory of the precise details is necessarily circumscribed. SignatureMike. Mike Lyle filted: >>> [...] >>>>> If someone falls backwards, he may be accident prone, but if he >>>>> falls the other way, there is no accident....r >>>> That sounds like a quotation from a sage. Confucius or Carlin, say? I made it up...I do have a faint recollection of hearing someone described as accident-prone because she couldn't seem to stay upright, and someone else correcting it to "prone-prone".... >>> I fainted at a bus stop over thirty years ago, and went straight >>> down on my face: I still have the scars on my upper lip, nose, and [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >I was either still insensible or on my way to hospital when it did >arrive. My memory of the precise details is necessarily circumscribed. I'm told that fainters fall face-first...some character on a TV show even used this fact to demonstrate that someone was faking the swoon...I've only watched one real person faint (a cousin of mine, at Six Flags Magic Mountain), and she did in fact bump her face on the pavement....r Signature"You got Schadenfreude on my Weltanschauung!" "You got Weltanschauung in my Schadenfreude!" > Mike Lyle filted: >>>>>> If someone falls backwards, he may be accident prone, but if he >>>>>> falls the other way, there is no accident >>>>> That sounds like a quotation from a sage. Confucius or Carlin, >>>>> say? > I made it up...I do have a faint recollection of hearing someone > described as accident-prone because she couldn't seem to stay upright, > and someone else correcting it to "prone-prone".... >>>> I fainted at a bus stop over thirty years ago, and went straight >>>> down on my face: I still have the scars on my upper lip, nose, and >>>> forehead. Seemed accidental to me. >>> Was the bus on time? >>That might have been sufficient cause for swooning. But I don't know, >>as I was either still insensible or on my way to hospital when it did >>arrive. My memory of the precise details is necessarily circumscribed. > I'm told that fainters fall face-first...some character on a TV show > even used this fact to demonstrate that someone was faking the > swoon...I've only watched one real person faint (a cousin of mine, at > Six Flags Magic Mountain), and she did in fact bump her face on the > pavement For what it's worth, I've fainted twice in my life, and both times it was a face-first crumple to the ground -- I went from standing to on my knees to face down. However, both of them were slow--I was still somewhat conscious until after I was on the ground, so it may be that I was controlling the fall in an attempt to minimize injury. However, in my stage movement classes, I recall being taught that for a staged faint- from-a-standing-position to be convincing it must be face-first. That's what the audience expects to see. A faint-from-a-seated-position should go in the direction the body is already leaning. > Mike Lyle filted: >>>> [...] [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > one real person faint (a cousin of mine, at Six Flags Magic Mountain), and she > did in fact bump her face on the pavement....r I fainted quite often as an anaemic teenager but somehow learned to crumple rather than tip forward. My most recent faint was over lunch in a restaurant: fortunately, we were between courses as I came round to find my face on the table and Daughter observing: "I suppose I'd better cancel the dessert order". SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) >> Mike Lyle filted: >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >> one real person faint (a cousin of mine, at Six Flags Magic Mountain), and she >> did in fact bump her face on the pavement....r >I fainted quite often as an anaemic teenager but somehow learned to >crumple rather than tip forward. My most recent faint was over lunch in >a restaurant: fortunately, we were between courses as I came round to >find my face on the table and Daughter observing: "I suppose I'd better >cancel the dessert order". And did she? And what happened next? We need be prepared, in case one of us is faced with this horrid decision at some future boink. SignatureKaty Jennison spamtrap: remove the first two letters after the @ >>> Mike Lyle filted: >>>>>> I fainted at a bus stop over thirty years ago, and went straight [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > And did she? And what happened next? We need be prepared, in case > one of us is faced with this horrid decision at some future boink. Indeed she did, to my considerable disappointment, as I recovered very quickly and no-one other than those at the table seemed to have noticed. However, the fainting was due to a dental crisis so I probably couldn't have eaten it anyway. Two other fainting episodes (on one occasion leading to a sprained ankle) have been precipitated by dental problems but my wisdom teeth are now long gone and I have a new dentist who inspires great confidence so I hope not to discombobulate future boinkers. (Note for future Oxboink opportunities: a branch of Patisserie Valerie has opened on the High - their web site has lovely pictures of cake: http://www.patisserie-valerie.co.uk) SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) >> What kind of stroke would be involved here in >> "you'k knock him on his a.s" [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > sufficient force to cause pain or injury, the action qualifies as > knocking someone on their a.s. My take: "you'd knock him on his a.s" can be taken literally -- that is, whoever "he" is would fall down on the floor (or ground) as a result of being knocked/punched. But: It can also be taken as pure hyperbole -- no falling down, perhaps not even any knocks or punches. (Think "bravado," or even feelings: "I was so angry, I wanted to knock him on his a.s.") > ...The method of the delivery of the > punch - uppercut, jab, roundhouse, etc - is irrelevant. Agreed. SignatureMaria C. |
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