Donne: A Valediction of Weeping.

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Marius Hancu - 20 May 2009 10:12 GMT

Hello:

"When a tear falls, that thou fall'st which it bore"
does it mean
"When a tear falls, that part of you, that instance of you, which bore
it, falls"
?

Also, the title:
"A Valediction of Weeping"
could it be read as:
"A Valediction full of Weeping"
or
"A Valediction consisting/made of Weeping"
or
"A Valediction about Weeping"
?

BTW, in some editions it's "A Valediction: of Weeping."

-----
LET me pour forth
My tears before thy face, whilst I stay here,
For thy face coins them, and thy stamp they bear,
And by this mintage they are something worth.
For thus they be
Pregnant of thee ;
Fruits of much grief they are, emblems of more ;
When a tear falls, that thou fall'st which it bore ;
So thou and I are nothing then, when on a divers shore.

A Valediction of Weeping.
by John Donne, p. 96
http://www.luminarium.org/sevenlit/donne/valweep.php
-----

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Thanks.
Marius Hancu

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CDB - 20 May 2009 16:12 GMT

> "When a tear falls, that thou fall'st which it bore"
> does it mean
> "When a tear falls, that part of you, that instance of you, which
> bore it, falls" ?

Yes, or "that image of you".

> Also, the title:
> "A Valediction of Weeping"
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> or
> "A Valediction about Weeping" ?

> BTW, in some editions it's "A Valediction: of Weeping."

I don't see why it can't be all three. What it clearly isn't is a
farewell to weeping. I wondered why you didn't ask about "when on a
divers shore." That's the one that puzzles me.

> -----
> LET me pour forth
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> http://www.luminarium.org/sevenlit/donne/valweep.php
> -----

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Marius.Hancu@gmail.com - 20 May 2009 18:00 GMT

> > "When a tear falls, that thou fall'st which it bore"
> > does it mean
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>
> I don't see why it can't be all three.

OK, fine with me:-)

>What it clearly isn't is a
> farewell to weeping. I wondered why you didn't ask about "when on a
> divers shore." That's the one that puzzles me.

Norton: In different countries.

> > LET me pour forth
> > My tears before thy face, whilst I stay here,
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> > When a tear falls, that thou fall'st which it bore ;
> > So thou and I are nothing then, when on a divers shore.

Thank you.
Marius Hancu

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CDB - 20 May 2009 19:44 GMT

>>> "When a tear falls, that thou fall'st which it bore"
>>> does it mean
>>> "When a tear falls, that part of you, that instance of you, which
>>> bore it, falls" ?

>> Yes, or "that image of you".

>>> Also, the title:
>>> "A Valediction of Weeping"
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>>> "A Valediction about Weeping" ?
>>> BTW, in some editions it's "A Valediction: of Weeping."

>> I don't see why it can't be all three.

> OK, fine with me:-)

>> What it clearly isn't is a
>> farewell to weeping. I wondered why you didn't ask about "when on
>> a divers shore." That's the one that puzzles me.

> Norton: In different countries.

I can see that they are separated by the sea of his tears, and I
suppose I'm willing to supply an "each" after "when"; I suppose
"nothing" may be "worth nothing", bankrupt, he having poured out his
wealth of tears and she having fall'n along with her image on them;
but I was wondering why "when".

Having written that out, I don't find it quite so strange. Maybe I
wasn't thinking; not for the first time. Thanks.

>>> LET me pour forth
>>> My tears before thy face, whilst I stay here,
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>>> When a tear falls, that thou fall'st which it bore ;
>>> So thou and I are nothing then, when on a divers shore.

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Jerry Friedman - 21 May 2009 01:01 GMT

> Hello:
>
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
> BTW, in some editions it's "A Valediction: of Weeping."

Giving a clue that it's the valediction that talks about weeping,
rather than the far better one (imho) that forbids mourning.

--
Jerry Friedman

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Paul Wolff - 21 May 2009 22:34 GMT

>On May 20, 3:12 am, Marius Hancu <NOS...@videotron.ca> wrote:
>> Hello:
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
>Giving a clue that it's the valediction that talks about weeping,
>rather than the far better one (imho) that forbids mourning.

Very well.

They are not long, the weeping and the laughter,
Love and desire and hate:
I think they have no portion in us after
We pass the gate.

They are not long, the days of wine and roses:
Out of a misty dream
Our path emerges for a while, then closes
Within a dream.

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Ernest Dowson

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Discussion Groups / English Usage / May 2009

Donne: A Valediction of Weeping.