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Discussion Groups / English Usage / July 2009eithernet?
My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB connection, purchased a new ethernet card, and will install that later) The usage point here is the pronunciation of "ethernet". "eeether-net" or "ether-net"? I asked the techs, and the clerk at the computer store, and all three said either is correct. I'm not comfortable with this. Which is the more correct?  SignatureTony Cooper - Orlando, Florida > My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with > my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > The usage point here is the pronunciation of "ethernet". > "eeether-net" or "ether-net"? Pondian problem here - both are the same in BrE. I know AmE has a short E in ether and ethyl, but BrE has a long E. > I asked the techs, and the clerk at the > computer store, and all three said either is correct. > > I'm not comfortable with this. Which is the more correct? Eeether-net only in BrE. BTW, it's conventionally written with a capital E. SignatureDavid > > My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with > > my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Pondian problem here - both are the same in BrE. I know AmE has a > short E in ether and ethyl, but BrE has a long E. No and yes. It's a long e in "ether", at least in the part where I dwell. > > I asked the techs, and the clerk at the > > computer store, and all three said either is correct. I'm not > > comfortable with this. Which is the more correct? > > Eeether-net only in BrE. And in the US, at least in the part where I dwell. Brian SignatureDay 149 of the "no grouchy usenet posts" project > the Omrud wrote: >>> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with >>> my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > And in the US, at least in the part where I dwell. Same here -- long. Always has been. SignatureSkitt (in SF Bay Area) http://home.comcast.net/~skitt99/ > > the Omrud wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Same here -- long. Always has been. Ditto from the Middle Atlantic. The gas is also pronounced with the long E and has been at least since the late 1930s when I first encountered it for an appendectomy. SignatureJohn Varela Trade NEWlamps for OLDlamps for email >> >>> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone >> >>> with [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > long E and has been at least since the late 1930s when I first > encountered it for an appendectomy. I agree on e-e-e-thernet. But in my area ethyl (for tetraethyl), as long as I have been aware, has been pronounced as in the name Ethel, or even with the "e" of "net". In other words, with a "short e". SignaturePat Durkin durkinpa at msn.com Wisconsin > But in my area ethyl (for tetraethyl), as long as I have been aware, has > been pronounced as in the name Ethel... Hence Groucho's line, "If you run out of gas, get ethyl. If Ethel runs out, get Mabel." --Jeff SignatureThe comfort of the wealthy has always depended upon an abundant supply of the poor. --Voltaire > >> >>> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone > >> >>> with [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > been pronounced as in the name Ethel, or even with the "e" of "net". In > other words, with a "short e". Same here. There used to be jokes about Ethyl and soft shoulders. SignatureJohn Varela Trade NEWlamps for OLDlamps for email > > "eeether-net" or "ether-net"? > > Pondian problem here - both are the same in BrE. I know AmE has a short > E in ether and ethyl, It does in "ether"? Somebody needs to tell the good folks at Merriam-Webster, Random House, and the American Heritage Dictionary-- none list it even as a variant. SignatureChristian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de >>> "eeether-net" or "ether-net"? >> Pondian problem here - both are the same in BrE. I know AmE has a short [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Merriam-Webster, Random House, and the American Heritage Dictionary-- > none list it even as a variant. Well, maybe not everywhere. I've heard it, but I can't now remember where. SignatureDavid the Omrud filted: >> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with >> my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >Pondian problem here - both are the same in BrE. I know AmE has a short >E in ether and ethyl, but BrE has a long E. You may be thinking of the BrE pronunciation of "methane" with a long E.... (You Tarthan, me Thane!)...r SignatureA pessimist sees the glass as half empty. An optometrist asks whether you see the glass more full like this?...or like this? >> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with >> my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Pondian problem here - both are the same in BrE. I know AmE has a short > E in ether and ethyl, but BrE has a long E. Now I've got a problem with that: at school, in England, we learnt "ethyl" to rhyme with "methyl", both with a short E. "Ether", I agree, has a long one. >> I asked the techs, and the clerk at the >> computer store, and all three said either is correct. >> I'm not comfortable with this. Which is the more correct? > > Eeether-net only in BrE. BTW, it's conventionally written with a > capital E. SignatureRob Bannister > My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with > my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > The usage point here is the pronunciation of "ethernet". > "eeether-net" or "ether-net"? The joke works better if you spell it "either-net" there. > I asked the techs, and the clerk at the computer store, and all > three said either is correct. > > I'm not comfortable with this. Which is the more correct? But then again, the joke doesn't work because, as far as I've ever heard, "either-net" isn't used. So maybe it wasn't a joke. In that case, I'm not sure what you mean by your two pronunciations, since the only way I've heard "ether" pronounced is as /iTR/, with a long "e" and the "th" of "thin". Suffice it to say, this is the pronunciation that's been used at least since I first encountered it in 1982, including from people at Xerox PARC, where it was developed. The notion was that rather than having dedicated wires between pairs of computers, the computers just shouted their messages "into the ether" on a shared cable that multiple computers could plug into, the messages including the name of the computer that was supposed to listen (or an indication that it was intended for everybody). The intriguing part of the original Ethernet was the "cocktail party" approach to dealing with the problem of multiple computers deciding to talk on the cable at the same time and clobbering one another's messages. Everybody whose message gets destroyed shuts up for a randomly perturbed amount of time and tries again. If there's still a collision, you shut up for an exponentially-increasing longer period. Eventually, the randomness implies that both will pick restart times that don't step on one another. (Of course, if other computers decide to start speaking, it can get complicated, but it typically sorts itself out.) SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |This isn't good. I've seen good, 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |and it didn't look anything like Palo Alto, CA 94304 |this. | MST3K kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ >> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with >> my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >heard, "either-net" isn't used. So maybe it wasn't a joke. In that >case, I'm not sure what you mean by your two pronunciations, So which is it? "eeee-ther-net" or "eth-ther-net"? SignatureTony Cooper - Orlando, Florida >>> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone >>> with my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > So which is it? "eeee-ther-net" or "eth-ther-net"? Oh, certainly "eeee-ther-net". With "eeee-ther" like "ether". Do you pronounce "ether" with a short "e"? I don't think I've ever noticed anybody doing so, and neither the OED nor MWCD11 offer it as a pronunciation. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |Usenet is like Tetris for people 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |who still remember how to read. Palo Alto, CA 94304 kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ Evan Kirshenbaum skrev: > The intriguing part of the original Ethernet was the "cocktail party" > approach to dealing with the problem of multiple computers deciding to [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > to start speaking, it can get complicated, but it typically sorts > itself out.) A wireless net works the same way which explains why a 54 Mbit connection is no better than 27 Mbit - at best. SignatureBertel, Denmark >> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with >> my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >that's been used at least since I first encountered it in 1982, >including from people at Xerox PARC, where it was developed. It's a shame Xerox never tried to make money off it's inventions from PARC, like the mouse and the graphic user interface. or maybe Xwerox was just stupid, the way IBM was when it allowed Bill Gates to keep the rights to PCDOS. Signature************* DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen@cox.net) ************* * Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow * * My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps * >>Suffice it to say, this is the pronunciation that's been used at >>least since I first encountered it in 1982, including from people at >>Xerox PARC, where it was developed. > > It's a shame Xerox never tried to make money off it's inventions > from PARC, like the mouse and the graphic user interface. The mouse was developed at SRI, not Xerox. They were just the first to put it into a product. And they did try to make money off of GUIs. Their Star was the first commercial machine to have them (and the first commercial machine to have mice), and there were also Altos, Dandelions, and others. They just never caught on. They got the patent on Ethernet in '77. One of the inventors (Bob Metcalfe) left Xerox to start 3Com. The patent was turned over to IEEE in '83 to encourage the use of the system (as opposed to other systems such as Token Ring) and to make sure that machines from different vendors could talk to one another. This page http://bugclub.org/beginners/history/EthernetHistory.html asserts that the choice not to control the technology stemmed from a fear of antitrust problems when Xerox, DEC, and Intel started working together, with Intel making the chips and DEC making the interface cards. I hadn't heard that story before. On the other hand, that page misspells Metcalfe's name throughout, so perhaps it should be taken with a grain of salt. > or maybe Xwerox was just stupid, the way IBM was when it allowed > Bill Gates to keep the rights to PCDOS. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |You may hate gravity, but gravity 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |doesn't care. Palo Alto, CA 94304 | Clayton Christensen kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ >>> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with >>> my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > maybe Xwerox was just stupid, the way IBM was when it allowed > Bill Gates to keep the rights to PCDOS. The guy who formed Xerox was a great humanitarian, not a money-grubbing shlub like Bill Gates. --Jeff SignatureThe comfort of the wealthy has always depended upon an abundant supply of the poor. --Voltaire >> It's a shame Xerox never tried to make money off it's inventions >> from PARC, like the mouse and the graphic user interface. or [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > The guy who formed Xerox was a great humanitarian, not a money- > grubbing shlub like Bill Gates. "The guy who formed Xerox"? Who was that? The Xerox website doesn't even seem to say, though they note that the company was founded in 1906 (as The Haloid Company), so I suspect that he had little to do with any decisions that were made in 1978. Not knowing anything about him, I'd be willing to bet rather significant amounts of money that the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation has had a rather more sizeable humanitarian effect than anything he did. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |A burro is an a.s. A burrow is a 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |hole in the ground. As a Palo Alto, CA 94304 |journalist, you are expected to |know the difference. kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com | UPI Stylebook (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ >>> It's a shame Xerox never tried to make money off it's inventions >>> from PARC, like the mouse and the graphic user interface. or [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > 1906 (as The Haloid Company), so I suspect that he had little to do > with any decisions that were made in 1978. Sorry, my memory was a bit off. I was thinking of the guy who invented xerography, Chester Carlson. I'm sure IBM made a mistake with Gates, but dealing with him at all in the first place was the big mistake. > Not knowing anything about him, I'd be willing to bet rather > significant amounts of money that the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation > has had a rather more sizeable humanitarian effect than anything he > did. Bill Gates stole billions through monopolistic practices. Then Melinda came along and convinced him to start giving some away. I'm not impressed. --Jeff SignatureThe comfort of the wealthy has always depended upon an abundant supply of the poor. --Voltaire >> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with >> my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > only way I've heard "ether" pronounced is as /iTR/, with a long "e" > and the "th" of "thin". That last part surprised me, as I have only heard "aether/ether" pronounced with the th of "thistle". Annoyingly, the only dictionaries I could get to give me an audio pronunciation or a phonetic representation I could understand were American, and those did agree with you. SignatureRob Bannister >> But then again, the joke doesn't work because, as far as I've ever >> heard, "either-net" isn't used. So maybe it wasn't a joke. In [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > That last part surprised me, as I have only heard "aether/ether" > pronounced with the th of "thistle". Me, too. You pronounce "thin" and "thistle" with different initial consonants? > Annoyingly, the only dictionaries I could get to give me an audio > pronunciation or a phonetic representation I could understand were > American, and those did agree with you. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |Any programming problem can be 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |solved by adding another layer of Palo Alto, CA 94304 |indirection. Any performance |problem can be solved by removing kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com |one. (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ >>> But then again, the joke doesn't work because, as far as I've ever >>> heard, "either-net" isn't used. So maybe it wasn't a joke. In [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Me, too. You pronounce "thin" and "thistle" with different initial > consonants? It seems that, for a few brief moments yesterday morning, I did. Normal service has now been resumed and /D/ has been banished. SignatureRob Bannister >> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with >> my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > The joke works better if you spell it "either-net" there. That would doubtless explain why I couldn't figure out what the difference was supposed to be: they seemed to be two ways of representing the same pronunciation. I say "ether" the same way as I would say "eeether" if it were a word. Signatureathel > My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with > my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > I'm not comfortable with this. Which is the more correct? It's from the aether, so pronounce it like you pronounce ae in caesar, Jan > It's from the aether, > so pronounce it like you pronounce ae in caesar, Oh God! I was taught Latin at a certain school in Dulwich, London, between 1963 and 1970, and we were taught to pronounce "Caesar" like this: k ai - z ah r . We were also taught to pronounce 'v' like a modern 'w' - Sam Weller style. It still grates when I hear movie actors pronounce Latin as if it were modern Italian. Quoth contrex <mike.j.harvey@gmail.com>, and I quote: >> It's from the aether, >> so pronounce it like you pronounce ae in caesar, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >modern 'w' - Sam Weller style. It still grates when I hear movie >actors pronounce Latin as if it were modern Italian. But don't you find, on the one hand, that ordinary people give you strange looks when you pronounce Julius Caesar as Yoolioos Kaizahr and, on the other hand, that pedants sneer at your pronunciation of Latin intervocalic "s" as /z/? Did you happen to know John Marley at Dulwich, maybe two years later than you? SignatureJames > Quoth contrex <mike.j.harvey@gmail.com>, and I quote: > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Kaizahr and, on the other hand, that pedants sneer at your > pronunciation of Latin intervocalic "s" as /z/? According to a reasonable-looking comment on http://latinforum.org/viewtopic.php?p=14547 the progression was /kaesar/ /kesar/ /cesar/ /Sesar/ /sesar/ /sezar/, form borrowed from Old French /sezar/ in Great Vowel Shift According to the OED, it was "câsere" in Old English, which would have been pronounced /ka:sere/, which became "kaer" and was lost in Middle English and which was replaced by the French borrowing. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |Its like grasping the difference 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |between what one usually considers Palo Alto, CA 94304 |a 'difficult' problem, and what |*is* a difficult problem. The day kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com |one understands *why* counting all (650)857-7572 |the molecules in the Universe isn't |difficult...there's the leap. http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ | Tina Marie Holmboe Quoth Evan Kirshenbaum <kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com>, and I quote: >> Quoth contrex <mike.j.harvey@gmail.com>, and I quote: >> [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] >been pronounced /ka:sere/, which became "kaer" and was lost in Middle >English and which was replaced by the French borrowing. So the intervocalic /z/ is a very late development. SignatureJames > According to a reasonable-looking comment on > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > /sezar/, form borrowed from Old French > /sezar/ in Great Vowel Shift er, that last one should be /sizar/, of course. I don't know if the /ar/ reduced to /R/ then or later. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |There is something fascinating 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |about science. One gets such Palo Alto, CA 94304 |wholesale returns of conjecture out |of such a trifling investment of kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com |fact. (650)857-7572 | Mark Twain http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ > > Quoth contrex <mike.j.har...@gmail.com>, and I quote: > [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > /kesar/ > /cesar/ /c/ is the same as /tS/? > /Sesar/ > /sesar/ > /sezar/, form borrowed from Old French Professor Karl Uitti carefully pronounced Old French (and Old Provencal) "c" before "e" and "i" as /ts/, which also seems reasonable. But maybe he was wrong, or maybe reconstructions have changed in almost thirty years. > /sezar/ in Great Vowel Shift ... -- Jerry Friedman > > /kaesar/ > > /kesar/ > > /cesar/ > > /c/ is the same as /tS/? I assumed a voiceless palatal stop like Hungarian <ty>. SignatureChristian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de Christian Weisgerber filted: >> > /kaesar/ >> > /kesar/ [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >I assumed a voiceless palatal stop like Hungarian <ty>. In ASCII IPA it'd be an ichlaut, but from the rest of the posted sequence that doesn't seem to be the system in use....r SignatureA pessimist sees the glass as half empty. An optometrist asks whether you see the glass more full like this?...or like this? > Christian Weisgerber filted: > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > In ASCII IPA it'd be an ichlaut, but from the rest of the posted sequence that > doesn't seem to be the system in use....r I had the same confusion. After posting, I noticed that the ichlaut is /C/, not /c/. -- Jerry Friedman > Christian Weisgerber filted: >>>> /kaesar/ >>>> /kesar/ [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > In ASCII IPA it'd be an ichlaut, but from the rest of the posted > sequence that doesn't seem to be the system in use....r Isn't the Hungarian <ty> something like the last sound in the Russian <мать>, written in Latvian as <ķ>? SignatureSkitt (AmE) a very tiny bit Hungarian > >>>> /cesar/ > >>> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Isn't the Hungarian <ty> something like the last sound in the Russian > <мать>, written in Latvian as <ķ>? The English Wikipedia says that Hungarian <ty> is actually an affricate [cç], but I think traditionally it is treated as [c], as is Latvian <ķ>. Russian <ть> is usually analyzed as [tʲ], which I gather is not the same thing. Now that I think about it, Russian also has [kʲ]. [c] does serve as palatalized t for some languages (e.g. Czech <ť>), and as palatalized k for some others (e.g. Macedonian <ќ>). SignatureChristian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de >>>>>> /cesar/ >>>>> /c/ is the same as /tS/? [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > [c] does serve as palatalized t for some languages (e.g. Czech <ť>), > and as palatalized k for some others (e.g. Macedonian <ќ>). I can't speak for the other languages, but I would find "c" very odd for Macedonian "ќ", which I would expect to be "Kj", One site on the Web suggests "CH" at the end of words, which sounds like the dialect near the Serbian border. SignatureRob Bannister >> According to a reasonable-looking comment on >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > /c/ is the same as /tS/? It's a palatal stop rather than an affricate. I presume that that's what he meant by "became palatalized (pronounced like English CH ...)", and it's the progression I'd expect from /k/ before a front vowel. An actual /tS/ without an intervening /c/ would surprise me. >> /Sesar/ >> /sesar/ [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >> /sezar/ in Great Vowel Shift /sizar/ SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |Any programming problem can be 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |solved by adding another layer of Palo Alto, CA 94304 |indirection. Any performance |problem can be solved by removing kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com |one. (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ > >> According to a reasonable-looking comment on > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > ...)", and it's the progression I'd expect from /k/ before a front > vowel. An actual /tS/ without an intervening /c/ would surprise me. Got it. I took "like English CH" to mean /tS/, in which case he was leaving out the very probable /c/ stage. > >> /Sesar/ ... -- Jerry Friedman > But don't you find, on the one hand, that ordinary people give > you strange looks when you pronounce Julius Caesar as Yoolioos > Kaizahr I tend not to talk about or in Latin to ordinary people. If they give me strange looks, I thrash them so that they may learn some manners. > and, on the other hand, that pedants sneer at your > pronunciation of Latin intervocalic "s" as /z/? I tell them that the pronunciation of intervocalic 's' in Latin is a thorny issue for scholars. Then I horsewhip them. > Did you happen to know John Marley at Dulwich, maybe two years > later than you? Alas, no. I am an Alleyn Old Boy, not an Old Alleynian. (That is, I went to Alleyn's School, not Dulwich College.) > > It's from the aether, > > so pronounce it like you pronounce ae in caesar, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > modern 'w' - Sam Weller style. It still grates when I hear movie > actors pronounce Latin as if it were modern Italian. Then pronounce it as ae in Caesar salad. Apart from that, the ultimate authority for the correct pronunciation of Caesar is of course Asterix, Jan Quoth nospam@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder), and I quote: >> > It's from the aether, >> > so pronounce it like you pronounce ae in caesar, [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >Then pronounce it as ae in Caesar salad. And spell it "Ceasar salad" to get the pronunciation right: http://cartoonbank.com/assets/1/51515_m.gif SignatureJames >> Oh God! I was taught Latin at a certain school in Dulwich, London, >> between 1963 and 1970, and we were taught to pronounce "Caesar" like [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Then pronounce it as ae in Caesar salad. Too easily confused with the German delicacy, Kaiser salad. SignatureHistory teaches that grave threats to liberty often come in times of urgency, when constitutional rights seem too extravagant to endure. (Thurgood Marshall) >> It's from the aether, >> so pronounce it like you pronounce ae in caesar, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >this: k ai - z ah r . We were also taught to pronounce 'v' like a >modern 'w' - Sam Weller style. "Julius Caesar was therefore compelled to invade Britain again the following year (54 b.c., not 56, owing to the peculiar Roman method of counting), and having defeated the Ancient Britons by unfair means, such as battering-rams, tortoises, hippocausts, centipedes, axes, and bundles, set the memorable Latin sentence, 'Veni, Vidi, Vici', which the Romans, who were all very well educated, construed correctly. The Britons, however, who of course still used the old pronunciation, understanding him to have called them 'Weeny, Weedy, and Weaky', lost heart and gave up the struggle, thinking that he had already divided them All into Three Parts." ("The name's Kai zar. Yulioos Kaizar.") Cheers - Ian > >> It's from the aether, > >> so pronounce it like you pronounce ae in caesar, [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > heart and gave up the struggle, thinking that he had already divided > them All into Three Parts." Was this A Good Thing? DC -- > > >> It's from the aether, > > >> so pronounce it like you pronounce ae in caesar, [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Was this A Good Thing? It most certainly was a Good Thing, for the Britons were nothing but natives at the time, Jan [...] > > > The Britons, however, who of course still used the old pronunciation, > > > understanding him to have called them 'Weeny, Weedy, and Weaky', lost [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > It most certainly was a Good Thing, > for the Britons were nothing but natives at the time, See: <http://www.fromoldbooks.org/Marshall-AnIslandStory/pages/006- scantily-clad-british-soldiers/> -- VB > The usage point here is the pronunciation of "ethernet". > "eeether-net" or "ether-net"? I asked the techs, and the clerk at the > computer store, and all three said either is correct. What difference are you trying to describe with "eeether" and "ether"? Both suggest /'iT@r/, which is in fact the pronunciation used in "Ethernet". The first vowel is the same as in "eat". Ethernet gets its name from the luminiferous (a)ether, the magical medium for the propagation of light. SignatureChristian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de >> The usage point here is the pronunciation of "ethernet". >> "eeether-net" or "ether-net"? I asked the techs, and the clerk at the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >Ethernet gets its name from the luminiferous (a)ether, the magical >medium for the propagation of light. The second pronunciation is close to "eth-ther-net". I can't give you a sound-alike, but it's not the "eee" sound as in the ether that used to be used to knock you out. SignatureTony Cooper - Orlando, Florida >>> The usage point here is the pronunciation of "ethernet". >>> "eeether-net" or "ether-net"? I asked the techs, and the clerk at the [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > a sound-alike, but it's not the "eee" sound as in the ether that used > to be used to knock you out. So like in "ethnic" or "ethanol". I would have said "ethereal" (which comes from "ether", but while I pronounce it with /E/, both the OED and MWCD11 give it as /I/. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |Marge: You liked Rashomon. 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |Homer: That's not how *I* remember Palo Alto, CA 94304 | it. kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ > My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with > my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > I'm not comfortable with this. Which is the more correct? I've always heard, and said, it with a long 'e.' --Jeff SignatureThe comfort of the wealthy has always depended upon an abundant supply of the poor. --Voltaire > My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with > my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > I'm not comfortable with this. Which is the more correct? That wire thingy that plugs in the side. >> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with >> my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > That wire thingy that plugs in the side. That's not real ethernet. Real ethernet is coaxial cable that you attach to your computer with a T connector. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |Oh, forget it: I can't write about 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |this anymore until I find a much Palo Alto, CA 94304 |more sarcastic typeface. | Bill Bickel kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ >>> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with >>> my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > That's not real ethernet. Real ethernet is coaxial cable that you > attach to your computer with a T connector. Okay - sorry. That thick wire thing that plugs into the side. >>> That wire thingy that plugs in the side. >> >> That's not real ethernet. Real ethernet is coaxial cable that you >> attach to your computer with a T connector. >> > Okay - sorry. That thick wire thing that plugs into the side. Still not quite right, though I didn't phrase it correctly. You attach you computer to the network, not the other way around. The cable[1] doesn't "plug into" the side. The network card has a bit that sticks out and plugs into the (female) connector. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/10BASE-2 [1] While I'm okay with calling Cat-5 "wire", it doesn't seem quite right to call coax "wire". It's "cable". SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |In the beginning, there were no 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |reasons, there were only causes. Palo Alto, CA 94304 | Daniel Dennet kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ >>> My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with >>> my provider's tech support. (I ended up switching to a USB [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > That's not real ethernet. Real ethernet is coaxial cable that you > attach to your computer with a T connector. Naah. Real ethernet uses "thick yellow cable with vampire taps as a shared medium": [quote] The first Ethernet networks, 10BASE5, used thick yellow cable with vampire taps as a shared medium (using CSMA/CD). Later, 10BASE2 Ethernet used thinner coaxial cable (with BNC connectors) as the shared CSMA/CD medium. The later StarLAN 1BASE5 and 10BASE-T used twisted pair connected to Ethernet hubs with 8P8C modular connectors (not to be confused with FCC's RJ45). [endquote] <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethernet#Some_early_varieties> SignatureLes (BrE) Tony Cooper: > The usage point here is the pronunciation of "ethernet". > "eeether-net" or "ether-net"? I have no idea what distinction you're attempting to describe there. Perhaps the followups I will read next will make it clear. > I asked the techs, and the clerk at the > computer store, and all three said either is correct. But is that "either" with an E sound or "either" with an I sound? :-) > I'm not comfortable with this. Which is the more correct? Whichever one people use. Obviously, the word is derived from the now-discredited scientific concept of the luminiferous ether, so it makes etymological sense to pronounce the "eth" the same way. I don't think I've ever heard "ether" in the luminiferous sense pronounced, but I've only ever the heard "eth" in the chemical ether and in "ethernet" pronounced the same way -- with a long E and soft TH, as in "teeth". SignatureMark Brader, Toronto | Subway Emergency Instructions... msb@vex.net | * Do not pull the emergency cord. -- MTA, NYC My text in this article is in the public domain. Mark Brader filted: >Obviously, the word is derived from the now-discredited scientific >concept of the luminiferous ether, so it makes etymological sense >to pronounce the "eth" the same way. I don't think I've ever heard >"ether" in the luminiferous sense pronounced, but I've only ever >the heard "eth" in the chemical ether and in "ethernet" pronounced >the same way -- with a long E and soft TH, as in "teeth". I pronounce "teeth" with a hard TH; it's "teethe" that has the soft version....r SignatureA pessimist sees the glass as half empty. An optometrist asks whether you see the glass more full like this?...or like this? >Tony Cooper: >> The usage point here is the pronunciation of "ethernet". [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >But is that "either" with an E sound or "either" with an I sound? :-) Either, presumably. Cheers - Ian (BrE: Yorks., Hants.) > My ethernet connection went kerflooie so I've been on the phone with > my provider's tech support. I guess you had neithernet for a while. > The usage point here is the pronunciation of "ethernet". > "eeether-net" or "ether-net"? I asked the techs, and the clerk at the > computer store, and all three said either is correct. > > I'm not comfortable with this. Which is the more correct? I don't get this. Isn't "ether" pronounced the same way (/'iT@r/ or non-rhotic /'iT@/) throughout the English-speaking world? SignatureIn the 1970s, people began receiving utility bills for -£999,999,996.32 and it became harder to sustain the myth of the infallible electronic brain. (Stob 2001) |
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