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Discussion Groups / English Usage / July 2009Liberty Hall
Hello: In England, which Liberty Hall might be surmised here? Just a generic, hypothetical one, or a specific one? --- [Sillery, a don, organizes a party at his place for some of his students and proteges.] 'Come in,' said Sillery, picking up the picture, and setting it back in its place. 'Come in, Quiggin. Don't be shy. We shan't eat you. This is Liberty Hall. Let me introduce you to some of my young friends. Anthony Powell, A Dance to the Music of Time: Spring, p. 123 --- -- Thanks. Marius Hancu > Hello: > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Anthony Powell, A Dance to the Music of Time: Spring, p. 123 > --- I've always thought 'Liberty Hall' was used as a figure of speech, not as a reference to any of the large number of places actually named 'Liberty Hall'. Cheryl a generic, hypothetical one Marius Hancu wrote, in <80ff20c6-b67a-4049-8c1b-c6139b867583@k19g2000yqn.googlegroups.com> on Thu, 16 Jul 2009 03:28:17 -0700 (PDT): > Hello: > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Anthony Powell, A Dance to the Music of Time: Spring, p. 123 > --- Definitely generic, somewhere where all are welcome. The only actual Liberty Hall I know of is a trade union headquarters in Dublin, Ireland.  SignatureNick Spalding BrE/IrE > > In England, which Liberty Hall might be surmised here? Just a generic, > > hypothetical one, or a specific one? [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Definitely generic, somewhere where all are welcome. The only actual > Liberty Hall I know of is a trade union headquarters in Dublin, Ireland. Me, too:-) Thank you all. Marius Hancu Marius Hancu filted: >> > In England, which Liberty Hall might be surmised here? Just a generic, >> > hypothetical one, or a specific one? [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >Thank you all. Muck in, yer at yer granny's....r SignatureA pessimist sees the glass as half empty. An optometrist asks whether you see the glass more full like this?...or like this? > Marius Hancu wrote, in > <80ff20c6-b67a-4049-8c1b-c6139b867583@k19g2000yqn.googlegroups.com> [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > Liberty Hall I know of is a trade union headquarters in Dublin, > Ireland. As immortalised by Michael Moran, Zozimus: Ye men of sweet Liberty's Hall, And ye women all round the Coombe, On ye doth your Zozimus call, To sustain every shuttle and loom; SignatureJohn Dean Oxford > Marius Hancu wrote, in > <80ff20c6-b67a-4049-8c1b-c6139b867583@k19g2000yqn.googlegroups.com> [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > Liberty Hall I know of is a trade union headquarters in Dublin, > Ireland. A. Bertram Chandler, in his science stories, often had his John Grimes character welcome visitors with, "This is Liberty Hall. You can spit on the mat and call the cat a bastard." Brian SignatureDay 164 of the "no grouchy usenet posts" project >Marius Hancu wrote, in ><80ff20c6-b67a-4049-8c1b-c6139b867583@k19g2000yqn.googlegroups.com> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >Definitely generic, somewhere where all are welcome. The only actual >Liberty Hall I know of is a trade union headquarters in Dublin, Ireland. I googled "liberty hall" and am amazed at the number of hits, mostly across America. Signature************* DAVE HATUNEN (hatunen@cox.net) ************* * Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow * * My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps * > In England, which Liberty Hall might be surmised here? Just a generic, > hypothetical one, or a specific one? The Oxford Dictionary of English Proverbs has the usual metaphorical Liberty Hall use going back the Oliver Goldsmith play "She Stoops to Conquer" written in 1773. The quote goes "Mr. Marlow -- Mr. Hastings -- gentlemen -- pray be under no constraint in this house. This is Liberty-hall, gentlemen. You may do just as you please here." As usual, ODEP has no clue as to the origins. Google Books shows it was a popular term in London in the 1770s and 1780s -- it was the title of at least one song, a play at Drury Lane, and a political slogan. Part of the 1786 song by George Alexander Stevens, showing it was *not* there the usual metaphor of "do as you like": There are many fine Toasts, but the best of 'em all Is the Toast of the Times ; that is Liberty-Hall. That fine British building by Alfred was fram'd, Its grand corner-stone Magna Charta is nam'd; Independency came at Integrity's call, And form'd the front pillars of Liberty-Hall. This Manor our forefathers bought with their blood, And their sons, and their sons sons, have prov'd the deeds good; By that title we live, with that title we'll fall, For Life is not Life out of Liberty-Hall. Going earlier in time, it surprisingly turns up all over the American colonies, before and during the revolution, as the name of academies, meeting places, farms, etc. Did one inspire another? Were they all references to a much earlier Liberty Hall? Is this one of those cases where the British of that century adopted a (now-forgotten) Americanism? SignatureBest -- Donna Richoux |
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