Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us
Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network
Home
Discussion GroupsEnglish UsageBritish EnglishESL Teaching
Learnglish.com
Contact UsLink To UsSearch & Site Map

Discussion Groups / English Usage / July 2009



Tip: Looking for answers? Try searching our database.

Cobblers' alls

Thread view: 
Enable EMail Alerts  Start New Thread
Thread rating: 
Ildhund - 22 Jul 2009 11:54 GMT
In the recent thread about towel(l)ing, Peter Duncanson quoted a
passage from /The Times/:

"Children under 14 are being hit hardest and the NHS was told to
plan for a worst-case scenario of up to half of all children being
infected during a first pandemic wave."[1]

This is unremarkable, if we assume that 'children under 14' is a
subset of 'all children.' But I hear time and time again 'half of
all' or 'n percent of all' et sim. where no such comparison exists.
If I google "percent of all", I get a staggering number of hits.
Scanning the first page, I reckon that "all" is redundant in most of
them. A few examples from this and similar searches:

* 75 percent of all phishing emails target PayPal or eBay users
* 22 percent of all traffic accidents in the United States are
caused by drivers running red lights.
* More than half of all deaths of people of working age in Russia
are caused by alcohol
* Half of all British servicemen say they want to quit
* One third of all oceanic shark species at risk of extinction
* A quarter of all the largest public-sector database projects,
including the ID cards register, are fundamentally flawed
* half of all men and three-quarters of all women who have chlamydia
have no symptoms

There are many cases where the "all" is required, and others where
it might help, but I can't help getting annoyed at (particularly)
journalists who routinely stick one in where it's not needed. Any
statisticians out there?
Signature

Noel

[1] There was a typo in Peter's quotation which seems to have been
corrected since, with a recommendation turning into a diktat:
http://groups.google.co.uk/group/alt.usage.english/msg/ec16fa669c2f1c43?hl=en ,
cf. sixth para at
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/article6716477.ece .

Bertel Lund Hansen - 22 Jul 2009 13:25 GMT
Ildhund skrev:

> There are many cases where the "all" is required, and others where
> it might help, but I can't help getting annoyed at (particularly)
> journalists who routinely stick one in where it's not needed. Any
> statisticians out there?

I think you will see that in 62 % of all cases. (Oh well, a
pretty obvious remark)

How would you write instead?

Signature

Bertel, Denmark

Ildhund - 23 Jul 2009 22:13 GMT
Bertel Lund Hansen wrote...
> Ildhund skrev:
>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> I think you will see that in 62 % of all cases. (Oh well, a pretty
> obvious remark)

Omit 'all.'
Signature

Noel

CDB - 22 Jul 2009 13:27 GMT
> In the recent thread about towel(l)ing, Peter Duncanson quoted a
> passage from /The Times/:

> "Children under 14 are being hit hardest and the NHS was told to
> plan for a worst-case scenario of up to half of all children being
> infected during a first pandemic wave."[1]

> This is unremarkable, if we assume that 'children under 14' is a
> subset of 'all children.' But I hear time and time again 'half of
> all' or 'n percent of all' et sim. where no such comparison exists.
> If I google "percent of all", I get a staggering number of hits.
> Scanning the first page, I reckon that "all" is redundant in most of
> them. A few examples from this and similar searches:

> * 75 percent of all phishing emails target PayPal or eBay users
> * 22 percent of all traffic accidents in the United States are
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> * half of all men and three-quarters of all women who have chlamydia
> have no symptoms

In all the examples above, the word seems to be used to emphasise the
large size of the complete set.  (Not *"14.3 percent of all Snow
White's dwarfs".) You could call it an idiom.

> There are many cases where the "all" is required, and others where
> it might help, but I can't help getting annoyed at (particularly)
> journalists who routinely stick one in where it's not needed. Any
> statisticians out there?
Jerry Friedman - 23 Jul 2009 04:15 GMT
...

> * half of all men and three-quarters of all women who have chlamydia
> have no symptoms
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> journalists who routinely stick one in where it's not needed. Any
> statisticians out there?
...

Sure.  According to my calculations, 83% of all people who write "half
of all" also write "one of the only times" and "first ever".

--
Jerry Friedman doesn't know why he associates those expressions.
 
Sign In
Join
My Latest Posts
My Monitored Threads
My Blog
My Photo Gallery
My Profile
My Homepage

Start New Thread
Enable EMail Alerts
Rate this Thread



©2012 Advenet LLC   Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.