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Discussion Groups / English Usage / January 2010"a long man"; "death's door shoulder blades"
Ladies and Gentlemen, What follows is quoted from /The Citadel/ by A. J. Cronin: --- He was a long, thin, cadaverous man with a bald head streaked with jet black hair and drooping whiskers of the same colour. He wore a short alpaca jacket, green with age and the stains of drugs, which showed his bony wrists and death's door shoulder blades. His air was sad, caustic, tired; his attitude that of the most disillusioned man in the whole universe. --- - I gather that "death's door" is adjectival, but what does it possibly mean? Spooky? - And does "long" mean "tall" in British English? Best Wishes, Tacia > Ladies and Gentlemen, > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > - I gather that "death's door" is adjectival, but what does it > possibly mean? Spooky? To be "at death's door" is to be very close to death. I've never seen it used as an adjective before, but it looks as though he is so thin that he appears to be close to dying from starvation. > - And does "long" mean "tall" in British English? Not normally. I think it's poetic imagery.  SignatureDavid > Ladies and Gentlemen, > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > - And does "long" mean "tall" in British English? Usually "at death's door" means "dying", but in this case, referring to shoulder blades, and following 'bony', I think it means 'skeletal'. That is, very thin, just 'skin and bones'; not 'spooky'. 'Long' can mean 'tall', and not just in British English. I think it often implies 'tall and thin'. SignatureCheryl Cheryl filted: >> --- >> He was a long, thin, cadaverous man with a bald head streaked with jet [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >'Long' can mean 'tall', and not just in British English. I think it >often implies 'tall and thin'. You don't often hear of just a "long man"; it's almost always a "long, thin man"...I picture John Carradine in "Stagecoach"....r SignatureA pessimist sees the glass as half empty. An optometrist asks whether you see the glass more full like this?...or like this? > Cheryl filted: >>> --- [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > You don't often hear of just a "long man"; it's almost always a "long, thin > man"...I picture John Carradine in "Stagecoach"....r "A long drink of water" always sounds like it should refer to a tall thin cowboy. Maybe it's largely a western US term. SignatureCheryl >> Cheryl filted: >>>> --- >>>> He was a long, thin, cadaverous man with a bald head streaked with [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Maybe it's largely a western US term. Southern, I think, and it is "a tall drink of water", usually. SignatureSkitt (AmE) > >> Cheryl filted: > >>>> --- [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > >> You don't often hear of just a "long man"; it's almost always a > >> "long, thin man"...I picture John Carradine in "Stagecoach"....r Google Books results: "a long, thin man": 629 "a long man": 659 However, a lot of the hits on "a long man" had other meanings. The first said that in Jamaica, "He is a long man" means "he will carry an argument to extremes." (Cassidy and Le Page, /A dictionary of Jamaican English/.) A lot of the hits on both are from the 19th and early 20th centuries. Then there's this odd one: "One was a tall or rather a long man ; oldish, lean, seedy, solemn, with a hollow chest, a long lean face, and an unwholesome dusky unclean complexion." I don't know what distinction he's making. Edward Everett Hale, /Scrope; or, the Lost Library/ http://books.google.com/books?id=-7ERAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA523#v=onepage&q=&f=false > > "A long drink of water" always sounds like it should refer to a tall > > thin cowboy. > > > Maybe it's largely a western US term. > > Southern, I think, DARE says "chiefly Northern". We need somebody to say "eastern" to complete the set. > and it is "a tall drink of water", usually. Google Books results: "She's a tall drink of water": 5 "She is a tall drink of water": 1 "She's a long drink of water": 7 (one of which is from a DARE example from Maine that says "a long drink of water" there usually refers to females--to my surprise) "She is a long drink of water": 0 "He's a tall drink of water": 21 "He is a tall drink of water" 2 "He's a long drink of water": 14 (including this line of dialogue from a western, /Cinnabar/ by Lee Roddy: "He's a long drink of water, but broad shouldered and muscular." That surprises me: I expect the phrase to mean someone thin.") "He is a long drink of water": 3 So "tall" wins, as you said, but not by much. The "tall" version seems pointless to me--first you compare a tall person to a long drink, and then you use "tall" instead of "long" for the drink, getting you back where you started. It's like saying, "My dog is sick as a dog," or in an example from /Mad/ magazine in my childhood, "Cadillac: the Rolls-Royce of cars". -- Jerry Friedman >Google Books results: >"a long, thin man": 629 >"a long man": 659 And then there's the Long Man: http://66.102.9.132/search?q=cache:3gZYz712JbQJ:www.sussexpast.co.uk/longman/+lo ng+man&cd=2&hl=xx-elmer&ct=clnk&gl=uk&client=firefox-a or http://tinyurl.com/yctt2a7 SignatureKaty Jennison spamtrap: remove the first two letters after the @ >> Google Books results: >> "a long, thin man": 629 [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > or > http://tinyurl.com/yctt2a7 NTBCW the Cerne Abbas Geaunte: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerne_Abbas_giant>, who is also thought to be a 17-C fake. If so, he must have represented one in the eye ("in the _eye_?") for the Puritans. SignatureMike. >NTBCW the Cerne Abbas Geaunte: ><http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerne_Abbas_giant>, >who is also thought to be a 17-C fake. If so, he must have represented >one in the eye ("in the _eye_?") for the Puritans. "Be careful where you point that!" SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) >>>> Cheryl filted: >>>>>> --- >>>>>> He was a long, thin, cadaverous man with a bald head streaked [quoted text clipped - 70 lines] > as a dog," or in an example from /Mad/ magazine in my childhood, > "Cadillac: the Rolls-Royce of cars". My Google results were roughly 2 million to 1 million for "tall drink of water" vs. "long drink of water". SignatureSkitt (AmE) [long tall sallies] > "He's a long drink of water": 14 (including this line of dialogue > from a western, /Cinnabar/ by Lee Roddy: "He's a long drink of > water, but broad shouldered and muscular." That surprises me: I > expect the phrase to mean someone thin.") I think the "but" says your expectation is right. He's skinny but muscular, and kind of T-shaped. [...] >> You don't often hear of just a "long man"; it's almost always a "long, >> thin man"...I picture John Carradine in "Stagecoach"....r [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Maybe it's largely a western US term. I have only once encountered "A long drink of cold water" (sic), referring to a tall thin man. It's the title of a book of memoirs by Patrick Campbell (Patrick Gordon Campbell, 3rd Baron Glenavy), an Irish humorist known to UK audiences as a panel member on "Call My Bluff" about 30 years ago. Dad had a considerable collection of humorous writing; this book was on a bookshelf when I was small, so of course I read it. I read everything on the bookshelves. SignatureDavid >>> You don't often hear of just a "long man"; it's almost always a "long, >>> thin man"...I picture John Carradine in "Stagecoach"....r [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >I have only once encountered "A long drink of cold water" (sic), >referring to a tall thin man. I'm more familiar with "a long drink of water" to describe a tall, thin man. SignatureTony Cooper - Orlando, Florida >>>> You don't often hear of just a "long man"; it's almost always a "long, >>>> thin man"...I picture John Carradine in "Stagecoach"....r [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > I'm more familiar with "a long drink of water" to describe a tall, > thin man. That's certainly the my family described me when I was growing up. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |All tax revenue is the result of 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |holding a gun to somebody's head. Palo Alto, CA 94304 |Not paying taxes is against the law. |If you don't pay your taxes, you'll kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com |be fined. If you don't pay the fine, (650)857-7572 |you'll be jailed. If you try to |escape from jail, you'll be shot. http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ | P.J. O'Rourke On 06 Jan 2010, Tacia wrote > Ladies and Gentlemen, > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > - I gather that "death's door" is adjectival, but what does it > possibly mean? Spooky? It means that he looked like he was at death's door -- that he was about to die -- because he was so cadaverous, emaciated, and probably stooped that his shoulder blades were visible even through his jacket. > - And does "long" mean "tall" in British English? In this context, yes. SignatureCheers, Harvey CanEng and BrEng, indiscriminately mixed >On 06 Jan 2010, Tacia wrote > [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > >In this context, yes. There was a musician with the nickname Long John Baldry. He was 2.01m (6ft 7in) tall: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_John_Baldry And there was the fictional Long John Silver. SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) > Ladies and Gentlemen, > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > Best Wishes, > Tacia I don't think that anyone in the UK would use this phrase at all unless they were refering to the song "Long Tall Sally" popularised in the UK by Little Richard. >> Ladies and Gentlemen, >> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >unless they were refering to the song "Long Tall Sally" popularised in >the UK by Little Richard. Or, colloquially, "a long streak of piss" ("a gangling youth"). Cheers - Ian (BrE: Yorks., Hants.) >>> Ladies and Gentlemen, >>> [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > >Or, colloquially, "a long streak of piss" ("a gangling youth"). That's typical Nottinghamese. SignatureRobin (BrE) Herts, England >>>> Ladies and Gentlemen, >>>> [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] >> > That's typical Nottinghamese. My father would sometimes describe a tall man as "A long drink of water" ("If he fell down, he'd be halfway home!" More believeable in a baseball frame of reference.). SignatureFrank ess >Ladies and Gentlemen, > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > >- And does "long" mean "tall" in British English? Tall and of a thin build. It used to. Not so much nowadays. One of Jack the Ripper's possible victims, Elisabeth Stride, was known as "Long Liz". She was 5ft 5ins (165cm); tall for the time and place (1888, Spitalfields in London - then, one of the worst of London's inner-city slums), and her face at least was long and thin, if her mortuary photograph is anything to go by (http://www.casebook.org/victims/stride.html). Cheers - Ian (BrE: Yorks., Hants.) |
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