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Discussion Groups / English Usage / January 2010Turnup (Aus?)
Hello: An Australian tennis commentator has just used "turnup" as an "unexpected change of events." Is that common? I find: ---- turnup Function: noun 1 chiefly Britain : DISTURBANCE, FUSS, ROW; especially : FISTFIGHT, SET-TO 2 a : the turned-up part of an article of clothing b chiefly Britain : a cuff on a trouser leg <the black mud closed over his shoes and the turnups of his trousers -- Graham Greene> 3 a : a card turned faceup to fix or propose the trump b : UPCARD 1a M-W U ---- -- Thanks. Marius Hancu > Hello: > [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > Thanks. > Marius Hancu Long ago I was intrigued by this word, most commonly encountered in the expression "a turnup for the book". I enquired about this at World Wide Words but was not overly impressed by Quinion's response which explains the book part but not the turnup: http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-tur1.htm [Q] From Laura F Spira: I wonder if you can help with a query: what is the origin of the expression a turn up for the book, presumably indicating an unexpected outcome, a surprise? [A] It now means exactly what you say, something surprising. The origin is in horse racing, where the book was the record of bets laid on a race kept by — who else — a bookmaker. So when a horse performed in a way that nobody expected, so that most bets lost, it was something that benefited the book and so the bookmaker. The classic example would be a rank outsider that won with few bets on it, netting the bookmaker a nice windfall profit.  SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) >> Hello: >> [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] >rank outsider that won with few bets on it, netting the bookmaker a nice >windfall profit. The OED agrees: turn-up, n. and a. 3.b. spec. in Racing: see quot. 1873. Freq. in phr. a turn-up for the book(s); also in gen. use (colloq.), an unexpected turn of fortune, a surprise. 1873 Slang Dict., Turn up,..an unexpected slice of luck. Among sporting men bookmakers are said to have a turn up when an unbacked horse wins. 1895 Westm. Gaz. 10 Sept. 7/2 With such a moderate field nobody will be surprised if the result is a ‘turn-up’ as astonishing as was the victory of Throstle last year. 1900 Ibid. 15 May 8/1 The Jubilee Handicap on Saturday ended in a tremendous turn-up for the fielders. 1948 ‘J. TEY’ Franchise Affair xviii. 209 Won by a length and a half on a tight rein; and was that a turn up for the book! .... SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) On Jan 9, 7:24 am, "Peter Duncanson (BrE)" <m...@peterduncanson.net> wrote: > <la...@DRAGONspira.fsbusiness.co.uk> wrote: > >> An Australian tennis commentator has just used "turnup" as an > >> "unexpected change of events." [quoted text clipped - 58 lines] > 1948 ‘J. TEY’ Franchise Affair xviii. 209 Won by a length and a half > on a tight rein; and was that a turn up for the book! Thank you all. Marius Hancu > Hello: > > An Australian tennis commentator has just used "turnup" as an > "unexpected change of events." > > Is that common? I find: Not uncommon - especially in the phrase 'that's a turnup for the books'. No idea where the phrase comes from - maybe horse racing - or whether it's known in AmE, but it means an "unexpected change of events" or, rather, "a surprising event". DC -- > > Hello: > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > books'. No idea where the phrase comes from - maybe horse racing - or > whether it's known in AmE, I don't remember ever meeting it in an American context. > but it means an "unexpected change of > events" or, rather, "a surprising event". -- Jerry Friedman > > > An Australian tennis commentator has just used "turnup" as an > > > "unexpected change of events." [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > but it means an "unexpected change of > > events" or, rather, "a surprising event". Thanks for the reinforcement:-) Marius Hancu > Hello: > > An Australian tennis commentator has just used "turnup" as an > "unexpected change of events." > > Is that common? I find: Two words or hyphenated, not one. It's a shortening of the more common "that's a turn-up for the books". SignatureRegards John for mail: my initials plus a u e at tpg dot com dot au > > An Australian tennis commentator has just used "turnup" as an > > "unexpected change of events." [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Two words or hyphenated, not one. It's a shortening of the more common > "that's a turn-up for the books". I know what you mean, but my M-W U dictionary shows only one word, no hyphen, for the noun, as indicated in the above. Thank you all. Marius Hancu On 09 Jan 2010, Marius Hancu wrote >>> An Australian tennis commentator has just used "turnup" as an >>> "unexpected change of events." [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > I know what you mean, but my M-W U dictionary shows only one > word, no hyphen, for the noun, as indicated in the above. Interesting; Collins definitely hyphenates the noun. SignatureCheers, Harvey CanEng and BrEng, indiscriminately mixed >On 09 Jan 2010, Marius Hancu wrote > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > >Interesting; Collins definitely hyphenates the noun. The COD10, too: "turn-up 2 informal an unusual or unexpected event." SignatureRegards, Chuck Riggs, An American who lives near Dublin, Ireland and usually spells in BrE >>On 09 Jan 2010, Marius Hancu wrote >> [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > >2 informal an unusual or unexpected event." And I've always assumed that the "for the books" part means "for the record (history?) books" (something not to be forgotten). Signatureian >Hello: > >An Australian tennis commentator has just used "turnup" as an >"unexpected change of events." > >Is that common? I find: As in "that would be a turnup for the books"? Common in RSA too. SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk >>Hello: >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >Common in RSA too. Perhaps even more common than RSA, meaning the Republic of South Africa, is in the rest of the world. I only knew what RSA meant because I happen to know you live there, but it is not a standard acronym, AFAIK. SignatureRegards, Chuck Riggs, An American who lives near Dublin, Ireland and usually spells in BrE >>>Hello: >>> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >because I happen to know you live there, but it is not a standard >acronym, AFAIK. No, it isn't an acronym at all, but it is a standard abbreviation, and has been for the last 49 years. At times it has appeared on postage stamps. SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk >>>>Hello: >>>> [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >No, it isn't an acronym at all, but it is a standard abbreviation, and has >been for the last 49 years. At times it has appeared on postage stamps. I claim it is an acronym. SignatureRegards, Chuck Riggs, An American who lives near Dublin, Ireland and usually spells in BrE >>>Perhaps even more common than RSA, meaning the Republic of South >>>Africa, is in the rest of the world. I only knew what RSA meant [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >I claim it is an acronym. Well, as much as USA is, I suppose. SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk >>>>Perhaps even more common than RSA, meaning the Republic of South >>>>Africa, is in the rest of the world. I only knew what RSA meant [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >Well, as much as USA is, I suppose. Yup. USA, like NATO, laser and Aids, or AIDS, is another one, for each of these words is formed from the initial letters of other words. SignatureRegards, Chuck Riggs, An American who lives near Dublin, Ireland and usually spells in BrE >>>>> Perhaps even more common than RSA, meaning the Republic of South >>>>> Africa, is in the rest of the world. I only knew what RSA meant [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Yup. USA, like NATO, laser and Aids, or AIDS, is another one, for each > of these words is formed from the initial letters of other words. USA is the odd man out in that list. SignatureJames >>>>>> Perhaps even more common than RSA, meaning the Republic of South >>>>>> Africa, is in the rest of the world. I only knew what RSA meant [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >USA is the odd man out in that list. I would have thought so too, but perhaps Charles pronounces is "you sah!"., and it should be spelt "Usa". I once met a bloke who made an acronym of UFO. He pronounced it "you foe". But we pronounce RSA "are ess ay", not "RRRR-sah". SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk >>>>>>> Perhaps even more common than RSA, meaning the Republic >>>>>>> of South Africa, is in the rest of the world. I only knew [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > I once met a bloke who made an acronym of UFO. He pronounced it "you > foe". He isn't the only person in the world to do that. The OED puts that pronunciation first, suggesting that it's more common. I think I say both ufo and U-F-O. SignatureJames On 12 Jan 2010, James Hogg wrote >> I once met a bloke who made an acronym of UFO. He pronounced it >> "you foe". > > He isn't the only person in the world to do that. The OED puts > that pronunciation first, suggesting that it's more common. I > think I say both ufo and U-F-O. I see a rapid return to the discussion of URL as "earl" or "U-R-L". (FWIW, I tried for some time to think of it as letters, but my mind's ear still insists on rendering it as "earl".) SignatureCheers, Harvey CanEng and BrEng, indiscriminately mixed >On 12 Jan 2010, James Hogg wrote > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >(FWIW, I tried for some time to think of it as letters, but my mind's >ear still insists on rendering it as "earl".) For me it's the other way round, and when I cousin started talking about "earls" it took me a few second to catch up. SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk >> I once met a bloke who made an acronym of UFO. He pronounced it "you >> foe". > >He isn't the only person in the world to do that. The OED puts that >pronunciation first, suggesting that it's more common. I think I say >both ufo and U-F-O. The bloke I heard say it like that was a bit of a conspitracy nut, so I didn't feel inclined to imitate his pronunciation, lest it make me sound like a member of that club. I suspect that the meaning may also be diverging. SignatureSteve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk Steve Hayes filted: >I once met a bloke who made an acronym of UFO. He pronounced it "you foe". Never done in AmE, but I've often heard it in BrE (there was even a TV show by that name some forty years ago, and most of the cast pronounced it that way)...it even seems to be the choice in JpE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XS51heRa1-E >But we pronounce RSA "are ess ay", not "RRRR-sah". That'd be a real bear to have to deal with....r SignatureA pessimist sees the glass as half empty. An optometrist asks whether you see the glass more full like this?...or like this? >>>>>> Perhaps even more common than RSA, meaning the Republic of South >>>>>> Africa, is in the rest of the world. I only knew what RSA meant [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >USA is the odd man out in that list. Only is I misdefined acronym. SignatureRegards, Chuck Riggs, An American who lives near Dublin, Ireland and usually spells in BrE |
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