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Discussion Groups / English Usage / January 2010sh.t-eating grin
Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in AmE. From the context I gather it means something like 'looking like the cat that got the cream' but I am mightily puzzled. If I were eating sh.t I don't think I'd be grinning - far from it. I know that 'sh.t' can mean cannabis resin and eating that might make me giggle but AFAIK far more is smoked than eaten. Can one of our AmE friends please explain the origin and meaning of the phrase? > Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in AmE. > From the context I gather it means something like 'looking like the cat [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > smoked than eaten. Can one of our AmE friends please explain the origin > and meaning of the phrase? I can't help with the answer, as it's always puzzled me as well, but I can offer an example from the 70s, using my extensive knowledge of Harry Chapin lyrics. I shook his hand once, you know. Before he died, that is. My Old Lady by Harry Chapin She wore an S.E.G. when she came back home, Like the cat that ate the canary. And I stood befuddled, a chauvanist stud, With his mistress quite contrary ...  SignatureDavid Derek Turner filted: >Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in AmE. >From the context I gather it means something like 'looking like the cat [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >smoked than eaten. Can one of our AmE friends please explain the origin >and meaning of the phrase? If I remember correctly, George Carlin suggested that "sh.t-faced" for "drunk" might have come from someone so plastered he fell face-first into a pile of sh.t...perhaps the grin is that of someone so deliriously happy he doesn't even know (or care) what he's eating.... In connection with which: http://97.74.193.199/bliss.html ....r SignatureA pessimist sees the glass as half empty. An optometrist asks whether you see the glass more full like this?...or like this? > Derek Turner filted: > > >Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in AmE. > >From the context I gather it means something like 'looking like the cat > >that got the cream' If so, I've been misunderstanding that expression. I thought the cat that got the cream looked looked smug but self-controlled. A sh.t- eating grin is the biggest, widest, happiest possible grin. (Some college friends and I used to say another friend had a grin that expanded to fill the face available.) > > but I am mightily puzzled. If I were eating sh.t I > >don't think I'd be grinning - far from it. I know that 'sh.t' can mean > >cannabis resin and eating that might make me giggle but AFAIK far more is > >smoked than eaten. Very clever, but I think you're right to reject it. > > Can one of our AmE friends please explain the origin > >and meaning of the phrase? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > sh.t...perhaps the grin is that of someone so deliriously happy he doesn't even > know (or care) what he's eating.... ... Or a grin so wide that anything could get into the person's mouth? -- Jerry Friedman >> Derek Turner filted: >>> Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in >>> AmE. From the context I gather it means something like 'looking [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > Or a grin so wide that anything could get into the person's mouth? Here's what was said in this group in 1992: http://groups.google.com/group/alt.usage.english/msg/e475d8954bfd239c SignatureSkitt (AmE) > Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in AmE. > From the context I gather it means something like 'looking like the cat [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > smoked than eaten. Can one of our AmE friends please explain the origin > and meaning of the phrase? This is much older that the youth/drug culture of the second half of the 20th century. The sh.t-eating grin is that of one who is caught doing something very embarrassing. Someone who has a sh.t-eating grin has been up to something. Thus, it is understandable that someone who had been eating sh.t would exhibit a sh.t-eating grin. What wants explaining is why one was eating sh.t in the first place, about which can only be said: "De gustibus non est disputandum." This sh.t-eating grin is not unlike the expression of a dog who has been caught doing something for which it has been shamed many times before. I cannot really say that is the origin of the expression, but I point out that some dogs seem to find cat "pellets" irresistable. SignatureLars Eighner <http://larseighner.com/> Warbama's Afghaninam day: 45 1102.6 hours since Warbama declared Viet Nam II. Warbama: An LBJ for the Twenty-First century. No hope. No change. > Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in > AmE. From the context I gather it means something like 'looking [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > giggle but AFAIK far more is smoked than eaten. Can one of our AmE > friends please explain the origin and meaning of the phrase? The OED defines it pretty well as A broad grin expressing uncontrollable delight or (self-) satisfaction, esp. characterized by awareness of having got away with something normally considered outrageous or improper; (also) a consciously disarming, self-deprecating, slightly cheeky grin, often used to deflect censure or disapproval. I've always taken it to be the grin of someone so mentally out of it that he wouldn't think that there was anything wrong with eating sh.t. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |When you rewrite a compiler from 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |scratch, you sometimes fix things Palo Alto, CA 94304 |you didn't know were broken. | Larry Wall kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ >> Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in >> AmE. From the context I gather it means something like 'looking [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > that he wouldn't think that there was anything wrong with eating > sh.t. Partridge has a cite 'Most of us had to be sycophants ("sh.t-eating" we called it)' and attributes it to trawlermen. It seems like a contender - that sycophants are willing to eat sh.t from those they toady to ('brown-nosing') and do so with every appearance of pleasure. SignatureJohn Dean Oxford >> Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in >> AmE. From the context I gather it means something like 'looking [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > a consciously disarming, self-deprecating, slightly cheeky grin, > often used to deflect censure or disapproval. I subscribe to this interpretation (from the OED). One knows one has stepped in it and gotten away with it. One has risked and bluffed and everyone folded; no one called the bet. If we recall the "Sweet Violets" doggerel, I think the association with falling into sh.t and coming up smelling like roses is apt. > I've always taken it to be the grin of someone so mentally out of it > that he wouldn't think that there was anything wrong with eating > sh.t. > If we recall the "Sweet Violets" doggerel, I think the association > with falling into sh.t and coming up smelling like roses is apt. You know a different version than I do. Here's the one I learned back around 1952: There was a young farmer who lived by the crick. He'd get up each morning and play with his Marbles and toys that he bought at the store. He met a young lady he thought was a Very nice lady so nip and so tuck. She told him she'd teach him a new way to Raise a family, to sew and to knit While the boys in the barnyard were shoveling Sweet Violets, sweeter than the roses. Covered all over from head to toes, Covered all over with sweet violets! SignatureJohn Varela Trade NEWlamps for OLDlamps for email >> If we recall the "Sweet Violets" doggerel, I think the association >> with falling into sh.t and coming up smelling like roses is apt. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > Covered all over from head to toes, > Covered all over with sweet violets! Oh, much dirtier than the one I learned at my Momma's knee. But I only recall a line or two... Johnny went out to the woodpile Some kindling for to split. He grabbed hold of the axe handle It was covered all over with sweet violets. Chorus as you have it. > >> If we recall the "Sweet Violets" doggerel, I think the association > >> with falling into sh.t and coming up smelling like roses is apt. [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > > Chorus as you have it. My mother's version was cleaner too: There once was a farmer who took a young miss In back of the barn where he gave her a Lecture on horses and chickens and eggs, And said that she had the most beautiful Manners, which suited a girl of her charms, A girl that he wanted to take in his Washing and ironing and then if she did, They might get married and raise up some Sweet violets, etc. It's hard to believe that someone might need to bowdlerize getting married and raising kids. -- Jerry Friedman >> >> If we recall the "Sweet Violets" doggerel, I think the >> >> association [quoted text clipped - 49 lines] > It's hard to believe that someone might need to bowdlerize getting > married and raising kids. Those lyrics were sung in a popular song. On the radio, no less. Oh, "Those were the days!" John Varela filted: >> If we recall the "Sweet Violets" doggerel, I think the association >> with falling into sh.t and coming up smelling like roses is apt. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >Covered all over from head to toes, >Covered all over with sweet violets! I would have thought the song was much older than that, but Lissauer's says 1951 (although they do admit it's based on an older traditional song)...they also say the most popular version was that recorded by Dinah Shore, which seems improbable given her reputation and character.... According to the Demented Music Database (dmdb.org), a version was recorded in 1932 by Joel Shaw and His Band, which seems a more likely candidate....r SignatureA pessimist sees the glass as half empty. An optometrist asks whether you see the glass more full like this?...or like this? > John Varela filted: > > [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > the most popular version was that recorded by Dinah Shore, which seems > improbable given her reputation and character.... A clean version was very popular in 1951 or 52. It was probably the Dinah Shore version with the lyrics Pat quoted. I was a counselor in a summer camp in the summer of 1952 and learned the dirty version from some of the campers. > According to the Demented Music Database (dmdb.org), a version was recorded in > 1932 by Joel Shaw and His Band, which seems a more likely candidate....r SignatureJohn Varela Trade NEWlamps for OLDlamps for email >> Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in >> AmE. From the context I gather it means something like 'looking [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > that he wouldn't think that there was anything wrong with eating > sh.t. This inspired to look up coprophagia in the OED. There's one interesting quotation: "1944 Jrnl. Nerv. & Mental Dis. XCIX. 959 Among demented patients in advanced stages of their illness,..it is not rare to see some of them grasp their own feces, chew them and eat them often with great pleasure and satisfaction (coprophagia). " I'm not suggesting that this is necessarily the source of the expression. -- James >>> Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in >>> AmE. From the context I gather it means something like 'looking [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > >I'm not suggesting that this is necessarily the source of the expression. A sh.t-eating grin as I understand the term, and I think Lars would agree, is a guilty grin. SignatureRegards, Chuck Riggs, An American who lives near Dublin, Ireland and usually spells in BrE >>>> Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in >>>> AmE. From the context I gather it means something like 'looking [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > A sh.t-eating grin as I understand the term, and I think Lars would > agree, is a guilty grin. Amen. For me, it has always meant the humble, disarming grin of someone who has been caught in a transgression but hopes to be forgiven. It says "But you still like me, don't you? Just a little? Not now, but maybe in a while?" I had a dog like that. I've been wondering if it might be a scatological expansion of "sh--eepish". > Of late I keep coming across the expression 'sh.t-eating grin' in > AmE. From the context I gather it means something like 'looking [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > giggle but AFAIK far more is smoked than eaten. Can one of our AmE > friends please explain the origin and meaning of the phrase? Here is my take on it as recorded in my journal in 1956, based on usage among undergraduates at Caltech at that time: S.E.G. [noun, Caltech usage] = sh.t-EATING GRIN. 1. A grin accompanying the eating of sh.t, i.e. an embarrassed one. 2. A triumphantly asinine grin displayed by one who has got the better of you, and therefore so displeasing as to deserve the epithet "sh.t-eating". Signature--- Joe Fineman joe_f@verizon.net ||: Keep your friends close and your enemies closer. :|| |
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