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Discussion Groups / English Usage / April 2010Celine: Rows of pots and very little jam
Hello: "Rows of pots and very little jam" is this an idiom meaning, perhaps, that only a few of those admitted graduate? --- [He's got this M.D. degree, but it's been tough] The Science of Medicine is well defended, let me tell you; the Faculty is a battlemented stronghold. Rows of pots and very little jam. Louis-Ferdinand Celine, Journey to the end of the Night, p. 236 Tr. by John H.P. Marks --- -- Thanks. Marius Hancu >Hello: > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >Tr. by John H.P. Marks >--- Just as a guess, I'd say the comment refers to empty vessels in the faculty (staff). "Empty vessels" meaning, of course, something without much value.  SignatureTony Cooper - Orlando, Florida Marius Hancu a écrit : > Hello: > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Tr. by John H.P. Marks > --- It follows the French text rather faithfully. It's not an idiom in French and I doubt it is in English either. It's unfortunate that the translator missed the first part of what looks like an extended metaphor to me. In the French version, the Faculty is not "a battlemented stronghold", but "une armoire bien fermée", "a well-locked cupboard". I read both sentences to mean that the "jam" of Science is very difficult to get at: you first have to open the cupboard and then each one of the many pots to be able to scrape what little jam there is in them. SignatureIsabelle Cecchini On Apr 29, 5:03 am, Isabelle Cecchini <isabelle.cecch...@wanadoo.fr.invalid> wrote: > > "Rows of pots and very little jam" > > is this an idiom meaning, perhaps, that only a few of those admitted [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > and then each one of the many pots to be able to scrape what little jam > there is in them. Ah, I see it now. Thank you very much. Marius Hancu On Apr 29, 5:03 am, Isabelle Cecchini <isabelle.cecch...@wanadoo.fr.invalid> wrote: > > "Rows of pots and very little jam" > > is this an idiom meaning, perhaps, that only a few of those admitted [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > and then each one of the many pots to be able to scrape what little jam > there is in them. Now I wonder what is the exact difference in English between "pots of jam" and "jars of jam" esp as I see they have about the same frequency at Google Books. I wouldn't have used "pots of jam" before. Marius Hancu > On Apr 29, 5:03 am, Isabelle Cecchini > <isabelle.cecch...@wanadoo.fr.invalid> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > Marius Hancu I always think 'pots of jam' sounds like a British phrase. I'd use 'bottles' or 'jars'. SignatureCheryl > > On Apr 29, 5:03 am, Isabelle Cecchini > > <isabelle.cecch...@wanadoo.fr.invalid> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > I always think 'pots of jam' sounds like a British phrase. I'd use > 'bottles' or 'jars'. OK, then. Thank you. Marius Hancu >> On Apr 29, 5:03 am, Isabelle Cecchini >> <isabelle.cecch...@wanadoo.fr.invalid> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] >I always think 'pots of jam' sounds like a British phrase. I'd use >'bottles' or 'jars'. Interesting. To me, in BrE, jam usually comes in jars. However, "jam pot" is used to mean an item of crockery tableware to contain jam. This is the same principle as presenting sugar in a sugar bowl rather than putting a packet of sugar on the table. http://www.twenga.co.uk/dir-Homewares,Daily-use-crockery,Jam-jar-018446 The only other time I'd use "jam pot" rather than "jam jar" would be when referring to the miniature individual-serving containers used in cafes, restaurants, etc. A search of Lakeland.co.uk for "jam jars" found jam jars and jam jar accessories including "jam pot covers". http://www.lakeland.co.uk/F/keyword/jam%20jar A search for "jam pots" found some of the same items and, surprisingly, a fish kettle! http://www.lakeland.co.uk/F/keyword/jam%20pot The fish kettle page also suggested an "asparagus kettle". Whereas fish are "kettled" in a horizontal position: http://www.lakeland.co.uk/F/product/11652 Cooking asparagus can be tricky as the stalks take longer than the tender tips, but we'll let you in on a secret... steaming the asparagus upright makes it much easier to get it just right, and retain the delicate taste. Our dedicated stainless steel steamer is perfectly proportioned for the job, and a no-fuss way to cook corn on the cob too. I made the mistake of searching Amazon (UK). This will result in an email noting my interest in jam pots and making suggestions of jammy things I might like to buy. SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) On Apr 29, 7:33 am, "Peter Duncanson (BrE)" <m...@peterduncanson.net> wrote: > >> On Apr 29, 5:03 am, Isabelle Cecchini > >> <isabelle.cecch...@wanadoo.fr.invalid> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > However, "jam pot" is used to mean an item of crockery tableware to > contain jam. This lines up with what I thought I knew:-) Marius Hancu > I always think 'pots of jam' sounds like a British phrase. I'd use > 'bottles' or 'jars'. I've always thought of a pot of jam as a serving dish for jam. An unlidded (probably) bowl with a very small silver jam spoon in it. > Marius Hancu a écrit : > > Hello: [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > and then each one of the many pots to be able to scrape what little jam > there is in them. There are several similar phrases in English, though they are often used to mean someone who is lacking in mental capacity for some reason. I suspect the original of these is a few cards short of a full deck But there are many variations. One of my favorites is a few fries short of a Happy Meal which is currently being used quite a bit in news reports from California: <http://www.mantecabulletin.com/news/article/13840/> but there's many others<1> a couple of nuggets short of a meal (another McDonald's variation) a few watts short of a lightbulb three pickles short of a barrel a few clowns short of a circus a few stitches short of a row (my great aunt used to say this) a few ants short of a picnic a few bees short of a hive In fact, you can pretty much make up any appropriate phrase to fit a situation. If you worked in a pizza place you could easily say to a cow-orker that a fellow employee was "a few pepperoni short of a pie" and be perfectly understood. Interestingly the phrase can mean 'stupid' or it can mean 'mentally unstable' but it usually means something more in between those two, or it means shockingly, willfully stupid. While simply calling someone 'stupid' would be insulting, using this phrasing is, while still insulting, also dismissively so. In many cases, it is safe to omit the "of a ___" portion of the phrase. "He's a few {cards,clowns,fries,pepperoni} short" is enough to get the point across. <1> Oh look, there's that other-thread there's again. |
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