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Discussion Groups / English Usage / August 2010Hypothesized Question??
In discussing the Theory of Natural Selection, I was wondering whether it would be better or unnecessary to use 'the existence of" with "hypothesized" in the following sentence: "Scientists who subscribe to the Theory of Natural Selection hypothesized a creature, frequently called "the missing link," that provided a phylogenetic bridge between the prototypical ape and the prototypical human." "Scientists who subscribe to the Theory of Natural Selection hypothesized the existence of a creature, frequently called "the missing link," that provided a phylogenetic bridge between the prototypical ape and the prototypical human." Thanks in advance for the opinions. > In discussing the Theory of Natural Selection, I was wondering whether > it would be better or unnecessary to use 'the existence of" with [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > missing link," that provided a phylogenetic bridge between the > prototypical ape and the prototypical human." Both versions are acceptable, but I think I like the second one better. I presume you mean "subscribed", by the way. I don't think people talk about the missing link these days, but rather of a continuum of forms where there's no clearly defined point at which "Homo" became "Homo sapiens". Even if you are talking about present-day scientists, there's a mismatch of tenses between "subscribe" and "hypothesized". Actually, did evolutionary theorists ever talk about the missing link? I thought that that was a phrase used by the opponents of the theory.  SignaturePeter Moylan, Newcastle, NSW, Australia. http://www.pmoylan.org For an e-mail address, see my web page. >> In discussing the Theory of Natural Selection, I was wondering whether >> it would be better or unnecessary to use 'the existence of" with [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > >Both versions are acceptable, but I think I like the second one better. That was my feeling, too. Thanks >I presume you mean "subscribed", by the way. I don't think people talk >about the missing link these days, but rather of a continuum of forms [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >Even if you are talking about present-day scientists, there's a mismatch >of tenses between "subscribe" and "hypothesized". You're right, of course. Thanks for pointing that out. >Actually, did evolutionary theorists ever talk about the missing link? I >thought that that was a phrase used by the opponents of the theory. Actually, if i'm not mistaken, the geologist Charles Lyell first used it in his "Antiquity of Man" to support Darwin's thesis. >>> In discussing the Theory of Natural Selection, I was wondering whether >>> it would be better or unnecessary to use 'the existence of" with [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > Actually, if i'm not mistaken, the geologist Charles Lyell first used it > in his "Antiquity of Man" to support Darwin's thesis. Which puts me in the mind of my favorite quote from Konrad Lorenz, which, last time I looked (admittedly some considerable time ago), was to be found inscribed in a prominent location in the primate house at the Frankfurt (a/M) Zoo: "Das Übergangsglied vom Affen zum Mensch sind – wir" : The missing link between apes and humans is -- ourselves. (Though if you want to be pedantic "Übergangsglied" is not "missing link" but "transitional link" -- the proper German for "the missing link" being, if de.wikipedia.org is to be believed, "das Missing Link" or "das fehlende Bindeglied". And of course German "Affen" includes monkeys as well as apes, which is rather hard to capture in translation.) SignatureRoland Hutchinson He calls himself "the Garden State's leading violist da gamba," ... comparable to being ruler of an exceptionally small duchy. --Newark (NJ) Star Ledger ( http://tinyurl.com/RolandIsNJ ) Roland Hutchinson filted: >(Though if you want to be pedantic "Ãœbergangsglied" is not "missing link" >but "transitional link" -- the proper German for "the missing link" >being, if de.wikipedia.org is to be believed, "das Missing Link" or "das >fehlende Bindeglied". And of course German "Affen" includes monkeys as >well as apes, which is rather hard to capture in translation.) "Simian"?...r SignatureMe? Sarcastic? Yeah, right. > Roland Hutchinson filted: >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > "Simian"?...r That will do in contexts where a somewhat learned word won't be a distraction. "Affen" is a basic everyday sort of word, though. Well, every day that has monkeys or apes in it, at least. A violin method for young people that was recently adapted for English- speakers from a German original gets this amusingly wrong: the page that introduces the A-string has picture of monkeys on it. (The E-string has elephants, etc. At least I think they are elephants.) SignatureRoland Hutchinson He calls himself "the Garden State's leading violist da gamba," ... comparable to being ruler of an exceptionally small duchy. --Newark (NJ) Star Ledger ( http://tinyurl.com/RolandIsNJ ) Roland Hutchinson filted: >> Roland Hutchinson filted: >>> [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >introduces the A-string has picture of monkeys on it. (The E-string has >elephants, etc. At least I think they are elephants.) Shades of the Spanish-language "Sesame Street" I once watched...all the "letter of the day" and "number of the day" animations were the same as the English version of the same episode, with the sole exception of the one that culminated with "T is for Shark"....r SignatureMe? Sarcastic? Yeah, right. > A violin method for young people that was recently adapted for > English-speakers from a German original gets this amusingly > wrong: the page that introduces the A-string has picture of > monkeys on it. (The E-string has elephants, etc. At least I > think they are elephants.) For your info: _Affe_ = monkey (but is also used for "ape") _Menschenaffe_ = (anthropoid) ape [gorilla, orangutan, chimpanzee, bonobo; also gibbon] Cognate terms for "monkey" vs. "ape" also exist in Dutch, Swedish, etc.: English: monkey -- ape German: Affe -- Menschenaffe Dutch: aap -- mensaap, mensenaap Swedish: apa -- människoapa_ Signature~~~ Reinhold {Rey} Aman ~~~ "El hombre es tantas veces hombre cuanto es el número de lenguas que ha aprendido". -- Carlos I (Rey de España) >> A violin method for young people that was recently adapted for >> English-speakers from a German original gets this amusingly wrong: the [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > German: Affe -- Menschenaffe > Dutch: aap -- mensaap, mensenaap Swedish: apa -- människoapa_ It takes one to... Let me rephrase that: Thank you, as one member of the clade to another. SignatureRoland Hutchinson He calls himself "the Garden State's leading violist da gamba," ... comparable to being ruler of an exceptionally small duchy. --Newark (NJ) Star Ledger ( http://tinyurl.com/RolandIsNJ ) > In discussing the Theory of Natural Selection, I was wondering whether > it would be better or unnecessary to use 'the existence of" with [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > missing link," that provided a phylogenetic bridge between the > prototypical ape and the prototypical human." Peter Moylan" <invalid@peter.pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote Aug. 28: > Both versions are acceptable, but I think I like the second one better. > > I presume you mean "subscribed", by the way. I don't think people talk > about the missing link these days, but rather of a continuum of forms > where there's no clearly defined point at which "Homo" became "Homo > sapiens". It is prima facie a solecism of style to write: "Actors who now (present tense) XYZ did (past tense) ABC;" this becomes downright confusing when we are talking about scientists (living or dead.) Historical examples help. The "missing link" idea was indeed current 1880-1940, viz. the idea that a single fossil man might yet turn up that anatomists could link in time both forward to homo sapiens today and past to fossils of earlier ages that they agreed were not homo sapiens. That is why the Piltdown Man forgery was so interesting (more from the theoretical point of view than for actual palaentologists.) A difference today is that many more fossils have been discovered (including since 1935 all those African primates which suggest human ancestors first emerged in Africa) and theory has also changed, from the (linear) descent of one species e.g. man to the "branching bush" figure of clades. While incomplete, branching bush models still seek intermediate species in order to link reliably described species of different dates. Evolutionists also agree the theory implies an infinite regression, viz. whenever you find a new species C intermediate between A and E, that successfully links A and E, your critics can always demand you also find a new species B that bridges the difference (whatever makes them recognizably different species) between old A and new C. But professional evolutionists (e.g. Stephen Jay Gould) judge this explicable and no bar to continuing investigation. SignatureDon Phillipson Carlsbad Springs (Ottawa, Canada) > In discussing the Theory of Natural Selection, I was wondering whether > it would be better or unnecessary to use 'the existence of" with [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Thanks in advance for the opinions. I think the sentence reads *slightly* better with "the existence of", but if you hadn't drawn my attention to it I would think that "Scientists ... hypothesized a creature" was perfectly okay. "Theory of Natural Selection" should almost certainly be lower case. It's possible that there's a context that would require the capitals, but it it would be unusual. Is this sentence set in the nineteenth century? If it's set in the present day then it's wrong, because it's mussing the commas before and after "who subscribe to the theory of natural selection", since there are no scientists that don't. SignatureStan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA http://OakRoadSystems.com Shikata ga nai... >> In discussing the Theory of Natural Selection, I was wondering whether >> it would be better or unnecessary to use 'the existence of" with [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] >and after "who subscribe to the theory of natural selection", since >there are no scientists that don't. On the contrary, Stan: http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-scientists.html >>> In discussing the Theory of Natural Selection, I was wondering whether >>> it would be better or unnecessary to use 'the existence of" with [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-scientists.html Where, exactly, is your evidence that these people aren't living in the 19th century? SignatureRoland Hutchinson He calls himself "the Garden State's leading violist da gamba," ... comparable to being ruler of an exceptionally small duchy. --Newark (NJ) Star Ledger ( http://tinyurl.com/RolandIsNJ ) > > s this sentence set in the nineteenth century? If it's set in he > > resent day then it's wrong, because it's mussing the commas [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-scientists.html Calling them scientists doesn't make them scientists. SignatureStan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA http://OakRoadSystems.com Shikata ga nai... >> > s this sentence set in the nineteenth century? If it's set in he >> > resent day then it's wrong, because it's mussing the commas [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Calling them scientists doesn't make them scientists. For some of them, there's no question about whether they're scientists. The question would be whether they were creationists. Or would have been had they lived post-Darwin. SignatureEvan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------ HP Laboratories |Yesterday I washed a single sock. 1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |When I opened the door, the machine Palo Alto, CA 94304 |was empty. kirshenbaum@hpl.hp.com (650)857-7572 http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ >>> > s this sentence set in the nineteenth century? If it's set in he >>> > resent day then it's wrong, because it's mussing the commas before [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > The question would be whether they were creationists. Or would have > been had they lived post-Darwin. Agassiz and Pasteur were pretty clearly scientists. I'm not so sure about Newton and Kepler. SignatureRoland Hutchinson He calls himself "the Garden State's leading violist da gamba," ... comparable to being ruler of an exceptionally small duchy. --Newark (NJ) Star Ledger ( http://tinyurl.com/RolandIsNJ ) >> "Scientists who subscribe to the Theory of Natural Selection >> hypothesized the existence of a creature, frequently called "the [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > and after "who subscribe to the theory of natural selection", since > there are no scientists that don't. Be prepared to be surprised. The world is full of cranks, and some of those cranks have B.Sc. degrees. Your assertion might be true if you define "scientists" to be "those who accept the scientific method". SignaturePeter Moylan, Newcastle, NSW, Australia. http://www.pmoylan.org For an e-mail address, see my web page. >>> "Scientists who subscribe to the Theory of Natural Selection >>> hypothesized the existence of a creature, frequently called "the [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >Be prepared to be surprised. The world is full of cranks, and some of >those cranks have B.Sc. degrees. Heck, some of them have PhDs, even if they're self-awarded. L Ron Hubbard, for example. <quote> On February 10, 1953 Hubbard was awarded an honorary Ph.D. by Sequoia University, California, "in recognition of his outstanding work and contributions in the fields of Dianetics and Scientology." This non-accredited body was closed by the California state courts 30 years later after it was investigated by California authorities on the grounds of being a mail-order "degree mill". In 2009 The Times revealed that the British Government's Department of Health had investigated the provenance of this degree, and had concluded that Hubbard had bought Sequoia University and awarded the PhD to himself. </quote> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L._Ron_Hubbard#Education I saw for myself L Ron's entry in the personal column of The Times sometime after this, stating that he was handing his PhD back because of his disgust over something or another. Here it is: <q> Over three decades later, on March 8 1966 he took an advertisement in the personal column of The Times, 'resigning' his degree in the following words: "I, L Ron Hubbard of Saint Hill Manor, East Grinstead, having reviewed the damage being done in our society with nuclear physics and psychiatry by persons calling themselves 'Doctor', do hereby resign in protest my university degree as a doctor of philosophy (Ph.D.)..." </q> http://www.orato.com/world-affairs/profile-of-l-ron-hubbard Hilarious, what! SignatureRobin Bignall (BrE) Herts, England >>>> "Scientists who subscribe to the Theory of Natural Selection >>>> hypothesized the existence of a creature, frequently called "the [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > >Hilarious, what! As far as I know it is not possible for a properly earned and awarded doctorate to be "un-awarded". You can stop using the title and letters but you can't change history. Hmm - perhaps L Ron Hubbard did think he could change history. SignaturePeter Duncanson, UK (in alt.usage.english) >>>>> "Scientists who subscribe to the Theory of Natural Selection >>>>> hypothesized the existence of a creature, frequently called "the [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] > but you can't change history. Hmm - perhaps L Ron Hubbard did think he > could change history. I myself once had a doctorate in divinity, from a different degree mill. They gave me a nice certificate saying that I was licensed to marry people, and a few things like that. The degree was later un-awarded because I didn't send them money. Of course, I can hardly claim that it was properly earned, or even properly awarded. SignaturePeter Moylan, Newcastle, NSW, Australia. http://www.pmoylan.org For an e-mail address, see my web page. |
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