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Discussion Groups / English Usage / September 2010Meyer: as in
Hello: I wonder how old is this "as in ..."? ---- "But it just seems logical… a man and woman have to be somewhat equal… as in, one of them can't always be swooping in and saving the other one. They have to save each other equally." Stephenie Meyer, Twilight ---- -- Thanks. Marius Hancu > Hello: > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Stephenie Meyer, Twilight > ---- You hear it. It's used here just as a little introductory tag to link two thoughts, like "for example" or "(It's the) same as if..." Traditionally it would introduce a much shorter phrase than your example, and the first really would be contained in the second: ... think of "free" as in "free speech," not as in "free beer." ... "open" as in "open source" is misleading because  SignatureBest -- Donna Richoux > > I wonder how old is this "as in ..."? > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > ... "open" as in "open source" is misleading because Oh, I know it exists. I just wonder for how long was it has been used in front of longer phrases and followed by a comma. Thank you, Donna. Marius Hancu >> > I wonder how old is this "as in ..."? >> [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > used > in front of longer phrases and followed by a comma. As I read the paragraph, I wondered at the lack of quotation marks (you see how Donna uses them). "As in" sets the reader up for a citation from a source, or for a hypothetical example. But the paragraph also seems to be from a dialogue, so "air quotes" might have been gestured. I think the author should have given some such indication. Marius Hancu asks about: >>>> "But it just seems logical ... a man and woman have to be >>>> somewhat equal ... as in, one of them can't always be >>>> swooping in and saving the other one. They have to save >>>> each other equally." Donna Richoux writes: >>> Traditionally it would introduce a much shorter phrase than your >>> example, and the first really would be contained in the second: >>> >>> ... think of "free" as in "free speech," not as in "free beer." >>> >>> ... "open" as in "open source" is misleading because Pat Durkin: > As I read the paragraph, I wondered at the lack of quotation marks > (you see how Donna uses them). In informal usage, it's common to omit quotation marks that express a use/mention distinction. "I mean free as in free speech, not as in free beer." > "As in" sets the reader up for a citation from a source, or for > a hypothetical example... "air quotes" might have been gestured. > I think the author should have given some such indication. Air quotes would more likely *not* have been gestured, and I think the example is fine as a way to represent a common informal usage. If I saw it with quotation marks, I'd expect the passage to be a direct quotation, or at least a hypothetical one that actually uses the expression "as in". I agree with the suggestion that this informal usage may be a relatively new one. But of course one is often mistaken about that. SignatureMark Brader, Toronto | "We are informed many things, msb@vex.net | some of them correct." --Greg Goss My text in this article is in the public domain. >Marius Hancu asks about: >>>>> "But it just seems logical ... a man and woman have to be [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] >I agree with the suggestion that this informal usage may be a relatively >new one. But of course one is often mistaken about that. It looks to me like someone has been taught to avoid introducing comments with "like". SignatureRich Ulrich >>Marius Hancu asks about: >>>>>> "But it just seems logical ... a man and woman have to be somewhat [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > It looks to me like someone has been taught to avoid introducing > comments with "like". The problem with either "like" or "as in" in the original passage cite, to my ear at least, is that either of them needs to be followed by a noun phrase: "like <something>", or "as in <something>". When I get a whole independent clause instead, it sounds slightly odd to me, perhaps even non-standard (even for colloquial speech). Dern it all, thems is prepositions! They needs objects, they does. SignatureRoland Hutchinson He calls himself "the Garden State's leading violist da gamba," ... comparable to being ruler of an exceptionally small duchy. --Newark (NJ) Star Ledger ( http://tinyurl.com/RolandIsNJ ) >>>Marius Hancu asks about: >>>>>>> "But it just seems logical ... a man and woman have to be somewhat [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] >non-standard (even for colloquial speech). Dern it all, thems is >prepositions! They needs objects, they does. I meant to say, like, of course it is non-standard. SignatureRich Ulrich >>>>Marius Hancu asks about: >>>>>>>> "But it just seems logical ... a man and woman have to be [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > > I meant to say, like, of course it is non-standard. No sweat, dude. We're, like, cool. It's just, like, I probably didn't grow up hearing that construction so, like, it sounds funny to me, dig? As in, no way I'd ever use it. Um... SignatureRoland Hutchinson He calls himself "the Garden State's leading violist da gamba," ... comparable to being ruler of an exceptionally small duchy. --Newark (NJ) Star Ledger ( http://tinyurl.com/RolandIsNJ ) > I wonder how old is this "as in ..."? It seems familiar from 1960s sitcoms, but it was still pretty much a novelty in the mid-'70s. ¬R |
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