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Discussion Groups / ESL Teaching / December 2003reportet speach
Hallo ! was ist richtig: Original: can you bring these letters to the post office ? Umsetzen in reportet speach? Vielleicht kann mir da jemand helfen ? Grüße Franzi > Hallo ! > was ist richtig: [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Umsetzen in reportet speach? > Vielleicht kann mir da jemand helfen ? The original should be: "Can you *take* these letters to the post office?" Both the speaker and the listener are not at the post office, nor is the speaker going to be at the post office, so "bring" is not possible. Reported speech: I was asked to take some letters to the post office. (Or: I was asked whether I could take some letters to the post office.) Adrian | > Original: | > can you bring these letters to the post office ? | The original should be: "Can you *take* these letters to the post office?" | Both the speaker and the listener are not at the post office, nor is the | speaker going to be at the post office, so "bring" is not possible. The sentence, given without context, doesn't exclude that possibility. If the speaker and listener were arranging to meet at a later time at the post office, the speaker might ask the listener to bring the letters with him. Or the speaker might be at the post office and telephoning the listener to ask him to bring the letters to the post office. "These letters" may refer to letters which are being discussed, not necessarily ones which are near by. Owain > | > Original: > | > can you bring these letters to the post office ? [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > "These letters" may refer to letters which are being discussed, not > necessarily ones which are near by. You're trying too hard. Okay, the sentence doesn't exclude that possibility, but it's all but excluded. Given the context in which the sentence was found, ie. an English lesson, I can only say that the sentence is a mistake. Adrian > > | > Original: > > | > can you bring these letters to the post office ? [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > but it's all but excluded. Given the context in which the sentence was > found, ie. an English lesson, I can only say that the sentence is a mistake. Unfortunately, it is not a mistake; just American English. m. > > > | > Original: > > > | > can you bring these letters to the post office ? [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > > Unfortunately, it is not a mistake; just American English. ie. not good English. QED Adrian >>>>| > Original: >>>>| > can you bring these letters to the post office ? [quoted text clipped - 43 lines] > > ie. not good English. QED I presume this is meant to be ironic - it's difficult to describe standard American usage as bad usage since the overwhelming majority of English speakers are no speakers of American English - the rest of us have to like it or lump it. On the substantive matter under discussion I have no problem whatsoever with the use of "bring" in the sense of "take with you". Regards, einde O'Callaghan Quote > I presume this is meant to be ironic - it's difficult to describe > standard American usage as bad usage since the overwhelming majority of > English speakers are no speakers of American English - the rest of us > have to like it or lump it. Absolutely. And many forms of AmE place greater emphasis on grammatical accuracy and clear enuciation that BrE equivalents. > On the substantive matter under discussion I have no problem whatsoever > with the use of "bring" in the sense of "take with you". Einde, apologies for jumping to conclusions based on your name, but I wonder if this reflects your own background? There seems to be a usage in Irish varieties of English where 'bring' is used where other varieties would prefer 'take'. Things like:- "I remember the first day my father brought us to the school". I'm reading Joyce at the moment and this usage crops up a lot. I'd feel very inclined to correct Franzi's usage here. Regards DC Cat > Quote > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > I'd feel very inclined to correct Franzi's usage here. It is precisely because of my background that I find nothing strange with the usage - that was precisely the point I was trying to make - this usage is acceptable standard Irish English - and I believe it may also be acceptable usage in at least parts of America and Canada. Regards, Einde O'Callaghan Cool. You teach that then, and I'll teach "I was in Seoul 10 days". Regards, DC Cat > Cool. You teach that then, and I'll teach "I was in Seoul 10 days". I didn't say i teach it - I teach standard international English - I said I didn't find the usage strange given my background. Because I teach an internationally acceptable standard, I don't emphasise irish usage and I differentiate in class between "bring" and "take". Regards, Einde O'Callaghan |
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