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Discussion Groups / British English / October 2004Vibrancy and excitement.
Watching some tedious travelogue on TV recently, I was struck that every place mentioned was described as being both "vibrant" and "exciting" Some were even "one of the most exciting, vibrant places in ____ " (add country, continent of your choice). Much excited and vibrated (well... bored), I tried Googling for British towns/cities which _lack_ these mysterious qualites. I had to type in some fairly ludicrous candidates before I found any. Indeed, I seem to have spent most of my life surrounded by a degree excitement and vibrancy that I scarcely imagined. A crate of cyber champagne to anyone who can find a reasonably-sized British urban centre which isn't claimed on the Internet to be both vibrant and exciting.  SignaturePhil C. At 15:12:05 on Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Phil C. <philstoxicwaste@fsmail.net> wrote in <i92in0ddtiqmfk7m9jef5oiqst6fg8li4m@4ax.com>: >A crate of cyber champagne to anyone who can find a reasonably-sized >British urban centre which isn't claimed on the Internet to be both >vibrant and exciting. Well, I'm sorry to say I just googled for +lewes -vibrant -exciting (UK only) and came up with 173,000 hits, whereas +lewes +(vibrant OR exciting) produced only 17,300 (sometimes I wonder where Google gets its own figures). Population 2001 92,177. SignatureMolly Mockford I think I've been too long on my own, but the little green goblin that lives under the sink says I'm OK - and he's never wrong, so I must be! (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) >At 15:12:05 on Fri, 22 Oct 2004, Phil C. <philstoxicwaste@fsmail.net> >wrote in <i92in0ddtiqmfk7m9jef5oiqst6fg8li4m@4ax.com>: [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >exciting) produced only 17,300 (sometimes I wonder where Google gets its >own figures). Population 2001 92,177. In terms of web-page content, Lewes does seem to be overshadowed by the sheer excitement and vibrancy of nearby Brighton. However, all is not lost - http://tinyurl.com/5k6vk "1.7 We believe that rural East Sussex can be a vibrant, balanced and sustainable society where local people have reason and ability to work locally, where local skills and innovation are fostered to develop locally born and lead businesses, whilst also looking at how to encourage new and exciting business opportunities into the county." So you can obviously look forward to a large increase in vibrancy and excitement. I didn't realise there were lead mines in East Sussex, by the way, but you live and learn. SignaturePhil C. At 14:09:37 on Sat, 23 Oct 2004, Phil C. <philstoxicwaste@fsmail.net> wrote in <kvlkn0lkr6peiti6lv33rd78c4hru3coi1@4ax.com>: >"1.7 We believe that rural East Sussex can be a vibrant, balanced and >sustainable society where local people have reason and ability to work [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >excitement. I didn't realise there were lead mines in East Sussex, by >the way, but you live and learn. It can get a bit heavy, I must admit. SignatureMolly Mockford I think I've been too long on my own, but the little green goblin that lives under the sink says I'm OK - and he's never wrong, so I must be! (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) >> A crate of cyber champagne to anyone who can find a reasonably-sized >> British urban centre which isn't claimed on the Internet to be both [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > exciting) produced only 17,300 (sometimes I wonder where Google gets > its own figures). Population 2001 92,177. "falkirk +vibrant +exciting", 504 hits. My God. ========> Email to "j-c" at this site; email to "bogus" will bounce <======== Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760 <http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/purrhome.html> food intolerance data & recipes, Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files and CD-ROMs of Scottish music. At 20:07:00 on Sun, 24 Oct 2004, bogus address <bogus@purr.demon.co.uk> wrote in <12818@purr.demon.co.uk>: >>> A crate of cyber champagne to anyone who can find a reasonably-sized >>> British urban centre which isn't claimed on the Internet to be both [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >My God. Literal LOL. I don't know if you've ever been to Lewes, Jack, but I've been to Falkirk - and I would say that the proportions of hits seem about right! SignatureMolly Mockford I think I've been too long on my own, but the little green goblin that lives under the sink says I'm OK - and he's never wrong, so I must be! (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) "bogus address" <bogus@purr.demon.co.uk> wrote... > >> A crate of cyber champagne to anyone who can find a > >> reasonably-sized British urban centre which isn't claimed on the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > My God. "falkirk +vibrant +exciting +not!", 414 hits. Matti >"bogus address" <bogus@purr.demon.co.uk> wrote... >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >"falkirk +vibrant +exciting +not!", 414 hits. But that doesn't prove anything, as a page that included "Falkirk is vibrant and exciting, and not at all boring" would match. Of course, the 504 hits might also be misleading, referring to sites that say things such as "Falkirk cannot be described as vibrant and exciting". SignatureJohn Hall "Three o'clock is always too late or too early for anything you want to do." Jean-Paul Sartre (1905-1980) >>"falkirk +vibrant +exciting +not!", 414 hits. > >But that doesn't prove anything, as a page that included "Falkirk is >vibrant and exciting, and not at all boring" would match. Apologies. I failed to spot the exclamation mark. (Though I'm not sure how search engines would handle those.) SignatureJohn Hall "Three o'clock is always too late or too early for anything you want to do." Jean-Paul Sartre (1905-1980) >>>"falkirk +vibrant +exciting +not!", 414 hits. >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >Apologies. I failed to spot the exclamation mark. (Though I'm not sure >how search engines would handle those.) However, Falkirk is indeed vibrant and exciting. ScotRail say so and I've never known them lie. SignaturePhil C. > "falkirk +vibrant +exciting", 504 hits. Cracked it: "Your search - "Wigston Magna" +vibrant +exciting - did not match any documents." Giles. >>"falkirk +vibrant +exciting", 504 hits. > > Cracked it: > > "Your search - "Wigston Magna" +vibrant +exciting - did not match any > documents." However "Wigston Magna"+vibrant gets 1 hit and "Wigston Magna"+exciting gets 45 hits. Regards, Einde O'Callaghan > > "Your search - "Wigston Magna" +vibrant +exciting - did not match any > > documents." > > > However "Wigston Magna"+vibrant gets 1 hit and "Wigston Magna"+exciting > gets 45 hits. Bah. I'm not playing if I can't win. Giles. > Bah. > I'm not playing if I can't win. Wimp! I've been losing for years and I still keep playing. Signaturehttp://www.dacha.freeuk.com/photo/0y10-0.htm The Rock of Sisyphus The watershed on the Howden Moors in the Yorkshire Peak District >> > "Your search - "Wigston Magna" +vibrant +exciting - did not match any >> > documents." [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >I'm not playing if I can't win. <Sigh>. Well if you're going to sulk I'll have to send you a consolation prize of a bottle of cyber-cider, stolen from the clutches of a man who was lying in the gutter shouting at cars. He passed out before he could finish it. SignaturePhil C. > <Sigh>. Well if you're going to sulk I'll have to send you a > consolation prize of a bottle of cyber-cider, stolen from the clutches > of a man who was lying in the gutter shouting at cars. He passed out > before he could finish it. It had better not be corked. Giles. SignatureStill sulking. At 23:40:36 on Thu, 28 Oct 2004, Giles Todd <g@prullenbak.todd.nu> wrote in <jpp2o0llvf890upci7qgsmbf7b5p08vcgn@4ax.com>: >> <Sigh>. Well if you're going to sulk I'll have to send you a >> consolation prize of a bottle of cyber-cider, stolen from the clutches >> of a man who was lying in the gutter shouting at cars. He passed out >> before he could finish it. > >It had better not be corked. If it isn't, won't it all spill in the post? SignatureMolly Mockford I think I've been too long on my own, but the little green goblin that lives under the sink says I'm OK - and he's never wrong, so I must be! (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) >> "falkirk +vibrant +exciting", 504 hits. > >Cracked it: > >"Your search - "Wigston Magna" +vibrant +exciting - did not match any > documents." All is not lost, though. http://www.solicitorsnetwork.co.uk/8216-record.htm "Welcome to Leicestershire. Leicestershire County Council is the largest council in the attractive and vibrant County of Leicestershire." Well.... I suppose it would be the largest. A gold award for stating the bleedin' obvious. And while I'm in the mood to distribute awards, a gold award for Travel Drivel goes to http://www.visitengland.com/destinationguides/Heart_of_England/index.aspx which informs us that - "There is England and there is the Heart of England. This is the very heart of Britain..." Right... I think we've got the idea. I noticed (rambling on) that the film "City That Never Sleeps" was on TV late last night. 1953 and set in Chicago. A gold award to any British city which finds itself described as the "city that never sleeps". A gold award too to anywhere described as a place "of contrasts" a place where "the old meets the new" or a place "where time stands still". SignaturePhil C. >I noticed (rambling on) that the film "City That Never Sleeps" was on >TV late last night. 1953 and set in Chicago. A gold award to any >British city which finds itself described as the "city that never >sleeps". A gold award too to anywhere described as a place "of >contrasts" a place where "the old meets the new" or a place "where >time stands still". I'm irresistibly reminded of that marvellous spoof travelogue by Peter Sellers of forty-plus years ago: "Balham - Gateway to the South". SignatureJohn Hall "Hegel was right when he said that we learn from history that man can never learn anything from history." George Bernard Shaw (1856-1950) >>I noticed (rambling on) that the film "City That Never Sleeps" was on >>TV late last night. 1953 and set in Chicago. A gold award to any [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >I'm irresistibly reminded of that marvellous spoof travelogue by Peter >Sellers of forty-plus years ago: "Balham - Gateway to the South". Perhaps all PR hacks should be forced to watch it once a week. BTW, those who saw the news item yesterday about the Keep Britain Tidy Campaign assistant Chief Executive being disciplined for calling Wigan the arse-end of the world, will be pleased to note that Wigan is fighting back... by claiming to be vibrant and exciting - http://www.wigantoday.net/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=66&ArticleID=872147 SignaturePhil C. > BTW, those who saw the news item yesterday about the Keep Britain > Tidy Campaign assistant Chief Executive being disciplined for calling > Wigan the arse-end of the world, will be pleased to note that Wigan > is fighting back... by claiming to be vibrant and exciting - > http://www.wigantoday.net/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=66&ArticleID=872147 The mind truly boggles! But I suppose we have to settle for being vibrant and exciting now that we can't be gay. Signaturehttp://www.dacha.freeuk.com/penny/1d-01.htm Ayesha uttered a little Turkish yelp then upped her voluminous skirts and downed her voluminous knickers > I noticed (rambling on) that the film "City That Never Sleeps" was on > TV late last night. 1953 and set in Chicago. A gold award to any > British city which finds itself described as the "city that never > sleeps". A gold award too to anywhere described as a place "of > contrasts" a place where "the old meets the new" or a place "where > time stands still". Somewhat bafflingly, "Oxford always has more to discover", according to the City Council tourism web site. You can almost see it now, setting off with its map and its packed lunch.... and from http://www.cotswolds.info/oxford-city.htm we have > Oxford is the city of dreaming spires. The golden stone of university > buildings with there spires, towers and domes have shaped a graceful > and timeless city, which no visitor forgets. Lonely Planet tells us that Oxford "oozes questing youthfulness, scholarship and bizarre high jinks." Thankfully I have never noticed any of this. SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) > > Oxford is the city of dreaming spires. Also known to some as the city of screaming tyres. -- Mike Stevens narrowboat Felis Catus II Web site www.mike-stevens.co.uk > > I noticed (rambling on) that the film "City That Never Sleeps" was on > > TV late last night. 1953 and set in Chicago. A gold award to any [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >Lonely Planet tells us that Oxford "oozes questing youthfulness, >scholarship and bizarre high jinks." "Questing"? They must have been reading Evelyn Waugh. Or The Sword in the Stone. Local TV interviews with anybody at Cambridge University always take place on a punt. It must be the law. Or perhaps the producers think to themselves "Hey! Here's a really original idea for the interview. Let's do it on a punt!" Is it the same for Oxford? >Thankfully I have never noticed any of this. I had a look at the site for Lincolnshire Tourism. Yes, don't laugh. It's a tough gig. The poor dears are doing their best - http://www.visitlincolnshire.com/exec/100884 South Kesteven has now become "The Lincolnshire Vales". Apparently. The Fens have been given the tag "A Natural Manscape". That should bring the tourists flocking. We used to have a goat so perhaps we should have kept it in a Goatscape. The page for Spalding begins with refreshing honesty - "Spalding... is a town that has to be seen to be believed!" Yup. They can say that again. Sadly, it soon descends into excitement and vibrancy. We learn that "Spring is flower frenzy time around the bulb fields". I assume this refers to the annual ceremony of the bulb pickers being chased around the fields by immigration officials and benefit investigators. SignaturePhil C. >I had a look at the site for Lincolnshire Tourism. Yes, don't laugh. >It's a tough gig. The poor dears are doing their best - > >http://www.visitlincolnshire.com/exec/100884 It's difficult to express my reaction to those pages. Let's just say that I have delayed having lunch until the queasy feeling has abated. SignaturePeter Duncanson UK (posting from u.c.l.e) >>I had a look at the site for Lincolnshire Tourism. Yes, don't laugh. >>It's a tough gig. The poor dears are doing their best - [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >It's difficult to express my reaction to those pages. Let's just say that I >have delayed having lunch until the queasy feeling has abated. I've only just looked at the Vibrant Lincoln page. There I learn that "Lincoln has a strong literary heritage, the County having been home to Tennyson." So it seems that one unfashionable poet doth a strong literary tradition make. Warming to the task, I also followed the links to South Kesteven churches at - http://www.churchtourism.org/index2.htm I learned to "Expect the unexpected in South Kesteven's churches." I wonder what that means. The vicar dresses as a wombat? The crypt is used as an S&M dungeon? Who knows. We are also advised to - "Pick up a free 'Portraits in Stone' church trail at Tourist Information Centres and experience ecclesiastical ecstacy." Not too much ecclesiastical ecsasy, I hope, or the pages will get stuck together. SignaturePhil C. >>> I had a look at the site for Lincolnshire Tourism. Yes, don't laugh. >>> It's a tough gig. The poor dears are doing their best - [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > to Tennyson." So it seems that one unfashionable poet doth a strong > literary tradition make. Other Lincolshire poets can be googled from the vasty deep. The "contraversal" Geoff Tims; Sarah Kind; Barnaby Googe; Anonymous; Frank Mansell of Miserden; someone called Michael; Pilot Officer John Gillespie Magee Jr who wrote one poem called "High Flight" and died in a mid-air collision over Lincolnshire in 1941; and Laurence Eusden "who, by flattering the Duke of Newcastle, was made poet laureate in 1718". Lincolnshire. A county wreathed in the laurel of centuries of the English poetic tradition... ========> Email to "j-c" at this site; email to "bogus" will bounce <======== Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760 <http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/purrhome.html> food intolerance data & recipes, Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files and CD-ROMs of Scottish music. At 18:29:26 on Wed, 27 Oct 2004, bogus address <bogus@purr.demon.co.uk> wrote in <12832@purr.demon.co.uk>: >Other Lincolshire poets can be googled from the vasty deep. The >"contraversal" Geoff Tims; Sarah Kind; Barnaby Googe; Anonymous; [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >Laurence Eusden "who, by flattering the Duke of Newcastle, was >made poet laureate in 1718". Plus one I knew already: Jean Ingelow, who wrote "High Tide on the Coast of Lincolnshire" and came, I think, from Boston. SignatureMolly Mockford I think I've been too long on my own, but the little green goblin that lives under the sink says I'm OK - and he's never wrong, so I must be! (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) >At 18:29:26 on Wed, 27 Oct 2004, bogus address <bogus@purr.demon.co.uk> >wrote in <12832@purr.demon.co.uk>: [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >Plus one I knew already: Jean Ingelow, who wrote "High Tide on the >Coast of Lincolnshire" and came, I think, from Boston. Then there's the bloke who writes Elton John's lyrics. He's from Market Rasen. You needed to know that. And we shouldn't forget Robert Manning (various spellings) of Bourne, the mediaeval Gilbertine monk who wrote the morality poem "Handlyng Synne". In this he railed against the peasantry's practice of contraception. I don't know what method they used but perhaps the clue is in the title. Then again, the first mention of football is in a Gilbertine manuscript so perhaps the poem is about the synne of hande-balle in the penalty area. And Lincolnshire's strong literary heritage wouldn't be complete without mentioning that bloke who wrote "Foxe's Book of Martyrs" - everyone's favourite light holiday reading. Oooh... his name's on the tip of my tongue... Foxe! Yeah that's it. All in all I'm surprised they don't move the Booker Prize ceremony to these parts. I'm sure the local Corn Exchange could host it. SignaturePhil C. >>>I noticed (rambling on) that the film "City That Never Sleeps" was on >>> TV late last night. 1953 and set in Chicago. A gold award to any [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > themselves "Hey! Here's a really original idea for the interview. > Let's do it on a punt!" Is it the same for Oxford? No, people are generally interviewed against the background of a street full of buses because most of the interviews seem to be about the Oxford Transport Strategy (keep cars out and introduce residents' parking zones in all the suburbs so that it makes more sense to drive to Reading, Birmingham or London to shop/eat/go to the cinema; pedestrianise but spend a fortune on completely unsuitable road surfaces which need replacing instantly and on really uncomfortable street seating so that the drunks won't hang about; dress all this up as "green", conveniently ignoring the fact that research shows Oxford to be one of the most polluted city centres in the country) Sorry, I almost started ranting there. SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) >> Local TV interviews with anybody at Cambridge University always take >> place on a punt. It must be the law. Or perhaps the producers think to [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >polluted city centres in the country) Sorry, I almost started ranting >there. I think Cambridge must get the Lifetime Achievement Award for the best "green" transport idea of all time. It was free bike scheme, copying a scheme in Holland. You just picked up a free bike at any of the many purpose-built racks around the city, used it for your lawful purposes and then left it at any rack for the next punter. Lots of old bikes were done up for the purpose and painted green by young offenders on community service programmes. Once the scheme began, all the bikes were stolen so quickly that I never even saw one, although I walked past a couple of the racks quite regularly. It then turned out that the same thing had happened in Holland. Funny that. The planet is safe in their hands. SignaturePhil C. >> A crate of cyber champagne to anyone who can find a reasonably-sized >> British urban centre which isn't claimed on the Internet to be both >> vibrant and exciting. > Well, I'm sorry to say I just googled for +lewes -vibrant -exciting (UK only) > and came up with 173,000 hits, whereas +lewes +(vibrant OR exciting) produced > only 17,300 (sometimes I wonder where Google gets its own figures). > Population 2001 92,177. The 92,177 population surely refers to the whole of the District of Lewes, and not just to Lewes itself. I am sure that most people familiar with the area when hearing "Lewes" on its own would not suppose it was meant to include such places as Newhaven and Ditchling and wherever it is the local authority district stretches to cover to the north and west. Anyway, doesn't "vibrant and exciting" mean "the town centre is full of drunken teenagers at night"? Matthew Huntbach At 09:55:23 on Mon, 25 Oct 2004, Matthew Huntbach <mmh@dcs.qmul.ac.uk> wrote in <Pine.LNX.4.61.0410250950280.9015@frank.dcs.qmul.ac.uk>: >The 92,177 population surely refers to the whole of the District of Lewes, >and not just to Lewes itself. Yes indeed. Very foolish of me. The population of the town is, I suppose, around 11-12,000 (estimated by me on the basis that, some five years ago or so, there were around 3000 people on the electoral roll of one of the three wards). >Anyway, doesn't "vibrant and exciting" mean "the town centre is full of >drunken teenagers at night"? Pretty much - it actually means "the kebab shop in the High Street" which is very much the same thing. But, to be fair, the only drunken teenagers in the town centre at night are those who can't afford the train fare to Brighton... SignatureMolly Mockford, who always avoids West Street on a Saturday night (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) > A crate of cyber champagne to anyone who can find a reasonably-sized > British urban centre which isn't claimed on the Internet to be both > vibrant and exciting. "Birmingham: It's not sh.t" http://www.jonbounds.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/jon/brum/brum.php Giles. >> A crate of cyber champagne to anyone who can find a reasonably-sized >> British urban centre which isn't claimed on the Internet to be both [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >http://www.jonbounds.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/jon/brum/brum.php Indeed. How can it be sh.t when (among many)- http://www.aston.ac.uk/birmingham/ - tells us that "The Aston University Campus is in the centre of the exciting and vibrant city of Birmingham" Universities seem particularly prone to claiming excitement and vibrancy for their local areas. This may be because they're full of people with big brains who know about these things. Or it could be because they target teenagers who don't. SignaturePhil C. At 14:09:04 on Sat, 23 Oct 2004, Phil C. <philstoxicwaste@fsmail.net> wrote in <9ulkn05b5hoc7h55hskhvdj7svfoogbk3n@4ax.com>: >Indeed. How can it be sh.t when (among many)- >http://www.aston.ac.uk/birmingham/ >- tells us that "The Aston University Campus is in the centre of the >exciting and vibrant city of Birmingham" Phil, are you quite sure that you have enough to do this weekend? SignatureMolly Mockford I think I've been too long on my own, but the little green goblin that lives under the sink says I'm OK - and he's never wrong, so I must be! (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) >At 14:09:04 on Sat, 23 Oct 2004, Phil C. <philstoxicwaste@fsmail.net> >wrote in <9ulkn05b5hoc7h55hskhvdj7svfoogbk3n@4ax.com>: [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >Phil, are you quite sure that you have enough to do this weekend? Prob'ly not. I do find the language of travelogues/PR companies etc fascinating. Terms such as "exciting" and "vibrant" seem to have moved beyond cliche to become the MSG of the language - we hardly even notice them any more. Similarly, market towns are "bustling" and villages are "sleepy" - which is probably why they "nestle". SignaturePhil C. > Indeed. How can it be sh.t when (among many)- > http://www.aston.ac.uk/birmingham/ > - tells us that "The Aston University Campus is in the centre of the > exciting and vibrant city of Birmingham" Curses. Foiled again. Giles. On Saturday, in article <9ulkn05b5hoc7h55hskhvdj7svfoogbk3n@4ax.com> > Indeed. How can it be sh.t when (among many)- > http://www.aston.ac.uk/birmingham/ > - tells us that "The Aston University Campus is in the centre of the > exciting and vibrant city of Birmingham" What a load of baloney; UofA is by no means "in the centre" of Birmingham (vibrant or not). It's an inner-city suburb that's [just] within walking distance of the centre (I know, working late one night[1], I left my car in the uni car park, and walked in to Brum for a curry; that was singularly hairy trying to negotiate roads that were intended only for cars and not for pedestrians). Still, I suppose that it's closer to the centre than Birmingham University (and no, for those that might mistakenly think that Aston wasn't a "proper university", it did NOT arise through renaming some benighted Poly, like [say] Oxford Brookes. Rather, it was a CAT, created during the reign of Tony Benn as Minister of [the white heat of] Technology. So Aston has always been a "proper university".) > Universities seem particularly prone to claiming excitement and > vibrancy for their local areas. This may be because they're full of > people with big brains who know about these things. Or it could be > because they target teenagers who don't. Especially for Aston; there's one rather grotty pub just off-campus, and, err, that's it. (The main "industry" appears to be second-hand car sales.) [1] It was on one of the occasions when I had physically to be present, updating the operating system on the VAX which hosted the UK TeX Archive; mostly, I did that by remote control, logging in over Janet from 90 miles away. I even did BACKUPs over Janet to local magtapes where I was. SignatureBrian {Hamilton Kelly} bhk@dsl.co.uk "I don't use Linux. I prefer to use an OS supported by a large multi- national vendor, with a good office suite, excellent network/internet software and decent hardware support." > Still, I suppose that it's closer to the centre than Birmingham > University (and no, for those that might mistakenly think that Aston > wasn't a "proper university", it did NOT arise through renaming some > benighted Poly, like [say] Oxford Brookes. Rather, it was a CAT, > created during the reign of Tony Benn as Minister of [the white heat > of] Technology. So Aston has always been a "proper university".) And before that it was the Technical College. You appear to be re-defining "always", "proper" and possibly "university" :-) Incidentally, I see that the Victoria University of Manchester has finally merged with the University of Manchester Institute of Science and Technology. I advocated them doing that and calling themselves "Manchester United University" when what is now Manchester Metropolitan University wanted to call itself "Manchester City University" :-) SignatureJohn Briggs >> Still, I suppose that it's closer to the centre than Birmingham >> University (and no, for those that might mistakenly think that Aston [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >And before that it was the Technical College. You appear to be re-defining >"always", "proper" and possibly "university" :-) Yes - and for what it's worth, Oxford Brookes does very well in the Times Good University Guide - ahead of some older universities and hot on the heels of others. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/section/0,,716,00.html I suspect that in a few years most people will have become pretty hazy about the age of universities. I suspect too that worrying about the supposed status of institutions and which is the "best course" is a privelege of the young and (increasingly) well-heeled. With lifelong learning in the white heat of the globalised skill-based econmy (or something) most people wanting to do further courses and qualifications when they're older will choose between institutions within easy reach of home. My knowledge of universities in more recent years is only from experience of being a purveyor of high-class recorded music to the gentry. By God we used to get about - Universities everywhere from Yorks to Herts to East Anglia to Staffs. My top university, judged on nice atmosphere and friendly, helpful staff, was Leicester. Bottom of the heap was Nottingham. Nottingham Trent and Queens Medical Centre were much nicer. >Incidentally, I see that the Victoria University of Manchester has finally >merged with the University of Manchester Institute of Science and >Technology. I advocated them doing that and calling themselves "Manchester >United University" when what is now Manchester Metropolitan University >wanted to call itself "Manchester City University" :-) Is the Victoria University what most of us know as Manchester University? My son is within weeks ("apparently") of finishing his PhD thesis under the auspices of Manchester University. Were it to be renamed Manchester United he'd have to give it up and start again elsewhere. As would all decent right-thinking folk. SignaturePhil C. >>> Still, I suppose that it's closer to the centre than Birmingham >>> University (and no, for those that might mistakenly think that Aston [quoted text clipped - 40 lines] > renamed Manchester United he'd have to give it up and start again > elsewhere. As would all decent right-thinking folk. The Victoria University was a federal university, and had colleges at Liverpool and Leeds. These, however, became separate universities, and the remaining campus was re-named the Victoria University of Manchester - its official title until 1 October 2004, although for some reason the Queen didn't hand over the new Royal Charter until last week! You can relax - they have decided the call themselves "the University of Manchester" :-) SignatureJohn Briggs >>>Still, I suppose that it's closer to the centre than Birmingham >>>University (and no, for those that might mistakenly think that Aston [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > on the heels of others. > http://www.timesonline.co.uk/section/0,,716,00.html Thank you for pointing that out, Mr C. I was about to object to my place of employment being referred to as a "benighted Poly". NSOED says that benighted means "involved in intellectual or moral darkness" and, even on a really bad day, I don't think that's a good description of Brookes. Some of us can remember when the term "new" university was applied to the likes of Sussex and even the days when "redbrick" was a term uttered with some scorn... [..] >>Incidentally, I see that the Victoria University of Manchester has finally >>merged with the University of Manchester Institute of Science and >>Technology. I advocated them doing that and calling themselves "Manchester >>United University" when what is now Manchester Metropolitan University >>wanted to call itself "Manchester City University" :-) My daughter's year at Manchester Met lobbied unsuccessfully to retain the name Manchester Polytechnic on their degree certificates. > Is the Victoria University what most of us know as Manchester > University? Indeed, and it's my alma mater. My son is within weeks ("apparently") of finishing his PhD > thesis under the auspices of Manchester University. I like the "apparently". Were it to be > renamed Manchester United he'd have to give it up and start again > elsewhere. As would all decent right-thinking folk. SignatureLaura (emulate St. George for email) On Friday, in article <41829FC8.2000408@DRAGONspira.fsbusiness.co.uk> > Some of us can remember when the term "new" university was applied to > the likes of Sussex and even the days when "redbrick" was a term uttered > with some scorn... But,... but,... but: Sussex *IS* a "new university". Along with York, Exeter, Warwick, Aston, Surrey, etc. All the post-1950 ones, in fact. :-) SignatureBrian {Hamilton Kelly} bhk@dsl.co.uk "I don't use Linux. I prefer to use an OS supported by a large multi- national vendor, with a good office suite, excellent network/internet software and decent hardware support." >On Friday, in article > <41829FC8.2000408@DRAGONspira.fsbusiness.co.uk> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >:-) <Splutter> Surely anywhere founded after 1200 A.D. is a new university? SignaturePhil C. >> On Friday, in article >> <41829FC8.2000408@DRAGONspira.fsbusiness.co.uk> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > <Splutter> Surely anywhere founded after 1200 A.D. is a new > university? Why do you think New College, Oxford is called that? (It's official title is something like 'The College of St Mary of Winchester at Oxford' - but there's another St Mary's College.) SignatureJohn Briggs >> Yes - and for what it's worth, Oxford Brookes does very well in the >> Times Good University Guide - ahead of some older universities and hot [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >benighted means "involved in intellectual or moral darkness" and, even >on a really bad day, I don't think that's a good description of Brookes. I'd agree that being involved in intellectual darkness probably doesn't do much for a university's reputation. But moral darkness? We could have done with more of that when I was at university. SignaturePhil C. >>> Yes - and for what it's worth, Oxford Brookes does very well in the >>> Times Good University Guide - ahead of some older universities and [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > doesn't do much for a university's reputation. But moral darkness? We > could have done with more of that when I was at university. Our student union was the first to ever have a condom-dispensing machine (some time in the mid-'60s, I believe). It made a loss - and was taken away again! SignatureJohn Briggs |
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