 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
| HomeDiscussion GroupsEnglish UsageBritish EnglishESL Teaching Learnglish.com Contact UsLink To UsSearch & Site Map |
Discussion Groups / British English / February 2006hello
i am a stupid french who need to improve his english. i look for friends to talk in english about things and others... i understand quickly but need a lot of explains.. also if there some valorous friends here who are ready to lost time and time to try to explain how to use in a corect way english, i will be glad of this. friendly and hello to all members. > i am a stupid french who need to improve his english. i look for > friends to talk in english about things and others... Hello again ;-) > i understand quickly but need a lot of explains.. > > also if there some valorous friends here who are ready to lost time > and time to try to explain how to use in a corect way english, i will > be glad of this. Of course, that's what this group is for. Fire away with your questions and, of course, read what other people write so that you can see (usually) what is correct English. thanks ! writing english is something very necessary today. > thanks ! writing english is something very necessary today. Indeed it is. As is correct layout and punctuation ;-) So...capital letter at the beginning of phrases ('thanks' and 'writing' above) and for proper nouns (such as 'english'). Most people would have written what you did as "Thanks! Writing in English is something that is very necessary today. But without the 'that is' it is perfectly correct. Keep it up. John of Aix a écrit : > > thanks ! writing english is something very necessary today. > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > English is something that is very necessary today. But without the 'that > is' it is perfectly correct. Keep it up. Oh ! Many thanks for your lesson John. I go to try to keep it in my mind. Today it's sunny here and i will go to have a walk in the forest with my dog. I whises a good sunday for you. (is : Have a good sunday is correct?) At 02:42:51 on Sun, 12 Feb 2006, codis <alamtara@free.fr> wrote in <1139740971.339616.79630@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>: >Oh ! Many thanks for your lesson John. I go to try to keep it in my >mind. Today it's sunny here and i will go to have a walk in the forest >with my dog. I whises a good sunday for you. >(is : Have a good sunday is correct?) "Have a good Sunday" - we capitalise the names of the days of the week, and the months, in English. And "I go to try" should be "I am going to try" or "I will try". By "whises", I think you mean "wish".  SignatureMolly Mockford They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) Molly Mockford a écrit : > At 02:42:51 on Sun, 12 Feb 2006, codis <alamtara@free.fr> wrote in > <1139740971.339616.79630@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>: [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin > (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) A lot of mystakes in few words. My poor head ! I need a lot of drills if i want to start to write English properly. > John of Aix a écrit : > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > mind. Today it's sunny here and i will go to have a walk in the forest > with my dog. Have a nice day. It's sunny here too, it usually is fortunately, I live in Provence in southern France. I whises a good sunday for you. > (is : Have a good sunday is correct?) Yes, except it should be 'Sunday'. By the way, 'I' (when it means you) is alway's a capital letter. | I whises a good sunday for you. |> (is : Have a good sunday is correct?) | |Yes, except it should be 'Sunday'. "Have a good Sunday" is more of an American usage where it would be fine. In the UK it would be strictly correct, but we would tend to use "enjoy yourself on Sunday" SignatureDave Fawthrop <dave hyphenologist co uk> Freedom of Speech, Expression, Religion, and Democracy are the keys to Civilization, together with legal acceptance of Fundamental Human rights. Dave Fawthrop a écrit : > | I whises a good sunday for you. > |> (is : Have a good sunday is correct?) [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > the keys to Civilization, together with legal acceptance of > Fundamental Human rights. In France when we say "enjoy yourself" means something érotic. This was the reason I don't use this expression. > In France when we say "enjoy yourself" means something érotic. This > was the reason I don't use this expression. Well enjoy somebody else then! Paul Burke At 08:37:38 on Thu, 16 Feb 2006, Paul Burke <paul@scazon.com> wrote in <45is25F6rkf7U2@individual.net>: >> In France when we say "enjoy yourself" means something érotic. This >> was the reason I don't use this expression. >Well enjoy somebody else then! For some reason, the phrase "I enjoyed the Red Army Choir last night" comes to mind... SignatureMolly Mockford They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) At 09:08:45 on Thu, 16 Feb 2006, Molly Mockford <nospamnobody@mollymockford.me.uk> wrote in <c3YaUMLdEE9DFwe$@molly.mockford>: >At 08:37:38 on Thu, 16 Feb 2006, Paul Burke <paul@scazon.com> wrote in ><45is25F6rkf7U2@individual.net>: [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >For some reason, the phrase "I enjoyed the Red Army Choir last night" >comes to mind... Oops! "Phrase", forsooth - and in this of all newsgroups! The *sentence* comes to mind, of course. Ah well, just blame it on incompetence, incontinence, inconsequence and most probably insouciance. SignatureMolly Mockford They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) > At 09:08:45 on Thu, 16 Feb 2006, Molly Mockford > <nospamnobody@mollymockford.me.uk> wrote in > <c3YaUMLdEE9DFwe$@molly.mockford>: > >At 08:37:38 on Thu, 16 Feb 2006, Paul Burke <paul@scazon.com> wrote > >in <45is25F6rkf7U2@individual.net>: [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >For some reason, the phrase "I enjoyed the Red Army Choir last > >night" comes to mind... > Oops! "Phrase", forsooth - and in this of all newsgroups! The > *sentence* comes to mind, of course. > Ah well, just blame it on incompetence, incontinence, inconsequence > and most probably insouciance. Relax, Molly. It's just a phrase you're going through. SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ >At 08:37:38 on Thu, 16 Feb 2006, Paul Burke <paul@scazon.com> wrote in ><45is25F6rkf7U2@individual.net>: [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >For some reason, the phrase "I enjoyed the Red Army Choir last night" >comes to mind... LOL! SignatureJohn Hall "Honest criticism is hard to take, particularly from a relative, a friend, an acquaintance, or a stranger." Franklin P Jones >In France when we say "enjoy yourself" means something érotic. This >was the reason I don't use this expression. In English there are so many euphemisms and slang terms for sexual and toilet-related matters that it can be hard to say _anything_ without tripping over one of them. The "Carry On" films were built on such "double entendres". My Concise Oxford Dictionary tells me that expression is now obsolete in French(?) It's still standard in English. SignaturePhil C. >> In France when we say "enjoy yourself" means something érotic. This >> was the reason I don't use this expression. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > expression is now obsolete in French(?) It's still standard in > English. That's probably because the French is "double entente". SignatureJohn Briggs >> In France when we say "enjoy yourself" means something érotic. This >> was the reason I don't use this expression. > > In English there are so many euphemisms and slang terms for sexual and > toilet-related matters that it can be hard to say _anything_ without > tripping over one of them. I remember being startled by hearing someone lament on Radio 4 (probably the "Today" programme) about the number of jazz musicians who died young, "mostly from self-abuse" :-) SignatureJohn Briggs >>> In France when we say "enjoy yourself" means something érotic. This >>> was the reason I don't use this expression. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > (probably the "Today" programme) about the number of jazz musicians > who died young, "mostly from self-abuse" :-) Well I knew you went blind and it stunted your growth but this is ridiculous ;-) John of Aix a écrit : > > John of Aix a écrit : > > [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > By the way, 'I' (when it means you) is alway's a capital letter. I understand. You are a very good teatcher. Where do you live ? In England? > John of Aix a écrit : > [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > I understand. You are a very good teatcher. Where do you live ? In > England? No, I told you above. Read it again. Slowly ;-) It is indeed. In my country, you can't get a decent job if you don't speak at least good English. Regards VoD > thanks ! writing english is something very necessary today. >In my country, you can't get a decent job if you don't speak at least >good English. Anyone who can't speak good English but who wants a decent job should emigrate to Britain, where there seems to be no such requirement. :) SignatureJohn Hall "Honest criticism is hard to take, particularly from a relative, a friend, an acquaintance, or a stranger." Franklin P Jones |>In my country, you can't get a decent job if you don't speak at least |>good English. | |Anyone who can't speak good English but who wants a decent job should |emigrate to Britain, where there seems to be no such requirement. :) First define ?good? English. Use of regional variations started with Wilfred Pickles way back in the 1940s SignatureDave Fawthrop <dave hyphenologist co uk> Freedom of Speech, Expression, Religion, and Democracy are the keys to Civilization, together with legal acceptance of Fundamental Human rights. > First define ?good? English. > Use of regional variations started with Wilfred Pickles way back in > the 1940s 'Have a Go Joe", no? |> First define ?good? English. |> Use of regional variations started with Wilfred Pickles way back in |> the 1940s | |'Have a Go Joe", no? And many more things, including a newsreader. http://www.radioacademy.org/halloffame/pickles_w/index.shtml >>>Wilfred Pickles was an amateur actor when he made his first broadcast, for the BBC's North Regional service, in 1927. He began announcing in 1938 and was an occasional newsreader (the first with a regional accent) on the National programme from 1941. His sign-off, "...and to all in the North, good neet", caused indignation among traditionalists, <<< SignatureDave Fawthrop <dave hyphenologist co uk> Freedom of Speech, Expression, Religion, and Democracy are the keys to Civilization, together with legal acceptance of Fundamental Human rights. >|> First define ?good? English. >|> Use of regional variations started with Wilfred Pickles way back in [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >National programme from 1941. His sign-off, "...and to all in the North, >good neet", caused indignation among traditionalists, <<< He was used during the war as a newsreader because they thought his voice could not be impersonated in black propaganda broadcasts. SignaturePhilip Baker |>|> First define ?good? English. |>|> Use of regional variations started with Wilfred Pickles way back in [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] |He was used during the war as a newsreader because they thought his |voice could not be impersonated in black propaganda broadcasts. Just run a recording of him as a newsreader from the web above, the Halifax Dialect he uses is very mild. I have lived in the Halifax area all my life. Anyone know of a recording of "Have A Go" on the WWW? I need a at least a recording of a full ?contestant? for another project. SignatureDave Fawthrop <dave hyphenologist co uk> Freedom of Speech, Expression, Religion, and Democracy are the keys to Civilization, together with legal acceptance of Fundamental Human rights. > Anyone know of a recording of "Have A Go" on the WWW? I need a at > least a recording of a full ?contestant? for another project. Nothing in the new BBC archive thingy? I'd look for you except us wicked emigrants aren't allowed access to it because we don't pay a licence fee. The rotters. |> Anyone know of a recording of "Have A Go" on the WWW? I need a at |> least a recording of a full ?contestant? for another project. | |Nothing in the new BBC archive thingy? I'd look for you except us wicked |emigrants aren't allowed access to it because we don't pay a licence |fee. The rotters. Didn't know they had one, I will investigate. SignatureDave Fawthrop <dave hyphenologist co uk> Freedom of Speech, Expression, Religion, and Democracy are the keys to Civilization, together with legal acceptance of Fundamental Human rights. |> Anyone know of a recording of "Have A Go" on the WWW? I need a at |> least a recording of a full ?contestant? for another project. | |Nothing in the new BBC archive thingy? I'd look for you except us wicked |emigrants aren't allowed access to it because we don't pay a licence |fee. The rotters. According to a web site the ?contestants? did Party Pieces and I was hoping to show what "Party Pieces" were to Americans :-( SignatureDave Fawthrop <dave hyphenologist co uk> Freedom of Speech, Expression, Religion, and Democracy are the keys to Civilization, together with legal acceptance of Fundamental Human rights. Dave Fawthrop a écrit : > |> Anyone know of a recording of "Have A Go" on the WWW? I need a at > |> least a recording of a full ?contestant? for another project. [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > the keys to Civilization, together with legal acceptance of > Fundamental Human rights. Congratulations ! Your group is very interesting. I am sure I go to learn a lot in so clever company. >>>> First define ?good? English. >>>> Use of regional variations started with Wilfred Pickles way back in [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > He was used during the war as a newsreader because they thought his > voice could not be impersonated in black propaganda broadcasts. I've never heard that story, it's great. I can hear them now in the war room: "Brilliant Carruthers! The Pickles fellow, he's the chap we need. That'll fox those damn Bosch imitators". > Use of regional variations started with Wilfred Pickles way back in the > 1940s I didn't realise that my grandfather had acquired his Lancashire accent so late in life, having presumably used RP from about 1886 to the 1940s. Paul Burke >> Use of regional variations started with Wilfred Pickles way back in >> the 1940s > > I didn't realise that my grandfather had acquired his Lancashire > accent so late in life, having presumably used RP from about 1886 to > the 1940s. Well, that's roughly what Harold Wilson did, if you listen to recordings of the Oxford don who was President of the Board of Trade in Attlee's government... SignatureJohn Briggs >>I didn't realise that my grandfather had acquired his Lancashire >>accent so late in life,.. > Well, that's roughly what Harold Wilson did, HE NEVER DID!!! HE WAS A BLOODY YOKSHIREMAN!! THEY ARE A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT SPECIES! I'VE RUn out of green ink Paul Burke |> Use of regional variations started with Wilfred Pickles way back in the |> 1940s | |I didn't realise that my grandfather had acquired his Lancashire accent |so late in life, having presumably used RP from about 1886 to the 1940s. Ouch! William Pickles came from Halifax in the West Riding of Yorkshire. SignatureDave Fawthrop <dave hyphenologist co uk> Freedom of Speech, Expression, Religion, and Democracy are the keys to Civilization, together with legal acceptance of Fundamental Human rights. >|>In my country, you can't get a decent job if you don't speak at least >|>good English. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >Use of regional variations started with Wilfred Pickles way back in the >1940s I wasn't talking about regional variations, though, but things like my pet hate "would of". (Which we now see increasingly even in written English.) SignatureJohn Hall "Honest criticism is hard to take, particularly from a relative, a friend, an acquaintance, or a stranger." Franklin P Jones > I wasn't talking about regional variations, though, but things like my > pet hate "would of". (Which we now see increasingly even in written > English.) I hear you brother Not forgetting "there's six of them" etc, the singular plural that the BBC uses regularly. Here in France we have a similar commonly accepted fault (in an otherwise strict linguistic atmosphere), that of "on est allés" for 'on est allé', third person singular so no 's'. As people use 'on' in much the same way as 'nous', we, they have started to treat it as a plural. One doesn't see this often on printed paper but is becoming almost universal on film subtitles, which are common in cinema and on TV as many prefer to hear the original actors rather than have them dubbed. I fear that the constant repetition and visualisation of the fault will tend to make it the norm, just as 'there is six of them' etc is becoming the norm in English it seems. >I wasn't talking about regional variations, though, but things like my >pet hate "would of". (Which we now see increasingly even in written >English.) Assuming that the "o" of "of" is normally a schwa then you can't distinguish "would of" from "would've" in spoken English. SignaturePhilip Baker > >I wasn't talking about regional variations, though, but things like my > >pet hate "would of". (Which we now see increasingly even in written > >English.) > > Assuming that the "o" of "of" is normally a schwa then you can't > distinguish "would of" from "would've" in spoken English. I of usually noticed it in writing, though, as John Hall stated in the part have his message you quoted. Giles > >I wasn't talking about regional variations, though, but things like my > >pet hate "would of". (Which we now see increasingly even in written > >English.) > > Assuming that the "o" of "of" is normally a schwa then you can't > distinguish "would of" from "would've" in spoken English. Except that grammar dictates the appropriate word, just as one should usually be able to distinguish "rows" from "rose" by the sense, even though they sound identical. > > >I wasn't talking about regional variations, though, but things > > >like my pet hate "would of". (Which we now see increasingly even > > >in written English.) > > > > Assuming that the "o" of "of" is normally a schwa then you can't > > distinguish "would of" from "would've" in spoken English. > Except that grammar dictates the appropriate word, just as one should > usually be able to distinguish "rows" from "rose" by the sense, even > though they sound identical. Not in all dialects. Some folks profess a difficulty in hearing a distinction between "to" and "too", which to me seems as impossible as confusing "mutt" and "moot". SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ > > > >I wasn't talking about regional variations, though, but things > > > >like my pet hate "would of". (Which we now see increasingly even [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > distinction between "to" and "too", which to me seems as impossible as > confusing "mutt" and "moot". I don't distinguish the difference in sound, but I distinguish the difference in spelling and meaning from the context. > > Not in all dialects. Some folks profess a difficulty in hearing a > > distinction between "to" and "too", which to me seems as impossible > > as confusing "mutt" and "moot". > I don't distinguish the difference in sound, but I distinguish the > difference in spelling and meaning from the context. What about in words such as "today" or "tomorrow"? Do you pronounce them as "two day" and "two morrow"? SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ > > > Not in all dialects. Some folks profess a difficulty in hearing a > > > distinction between "to" and "too", which to me seems as impossible [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > What about in words such as "today" or "tomorrow"? Do you pronounce > them as "two day" and "two morrow"? Non sequitur. > > > > Not in all dialects. Some folks profess a difficulty in hearing > > > > a distinction between "to" and "too", which to me seems as [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > What about in words such as "today" or "tomorrow"? Do you pronounce > > them as "two day" and "two morrow"? > Non sequitur. How? Both words incorporate "to" with the usual short pronunciation of "to". I hear very little difference in the "to" of "let's go today Tony" and "let's go to Daytona". If you pronounce "to" as "too", then your "today's work" would be indistinguishable from "two day's work" (or even "two days' work"). SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ > > > > > Not in all dialects. Some folks profess a difficulty in hearing > > > > > a distinction between "to" and "too", which to me seems as [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > If you pronounce "to" as "too", then your "today's work" would be > indistinguishable from "two day's work" (or even "two days' work"). Fair enough, I think we're talking at cross-purposes. I concede that "to" and "too" often sound different but I think that this is more a case of a difference in emphasis than of spelling. The stress is usually on the word following "to" but usually falls on the word "too" itself, which leads us to lengthen its sound. However, if someone were to emphasise "to", viz "No, he was going TO Blackpool, not coming away", the distinction between "to" and "too" dwindles, to my ear at least. "Let's pop into Thoday's. Toodle-oo." :-) > > How? Both words incorporate "to" with the usual short pronunciation > > of "to". I hear very little difference in the "to" of "let's go > > today Tony" and "let's go to Daytona". > > > > If you pronounce "to" as "too", then your "today's work" would be > > indistinguishable from "two day's work" (or even "two days' work"). > Fair enough, I think we're talking at cross-purposes. Possibly so. > I concede that "to" and "too" often sound different but I think that > this is more a case of a difference in emphasis than of spelling. > The stress is usually on the word following "to" but usually falls on > the word "too" itself, which leads us to lengthen its sound. > However, if someone were to emphasise "to", viz > "No, he was going TO Blackpool, not coming away", the distinction > between "to" and "too" dwindles, to my ear at least. But not always to mine. I do hear some folk say the word "to" as "too" when stressed but it needn't be so; it is emphasised readily short. > "Let's pop into Thoday's. Toodle-oo." :-) SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ > > I concede that "to" and "too" often sound different but I think > > that this is more a case of a difference in emphasis than of > > spelling. > > The stress is usually on the word following "to" but usually falls > > on the word "too" itself, which leads us to lengthen its sound. > > However, if someone were to emphasise "to", viz > > "No, he was going TO Blackpool, not coming away", the distinction > > between "to" and "too" dwindles, to my ear at least. > But not always to mine. I do hear some folk say the word "to" as > "too" when stressed but it needn't be so; it is emphasised readily > short. Just to follow this up. I listened intently to the Radio 4 Today[1] programme this morning; Charlotte Green, the newsreader, consistently used a short "to", as did the majority of interviewees, especially if Dutch; John Humphreys used short "to" when confident of his following words but a lengthened "too" when appearing to be thinking what to say next (i.e. the lengthening seemed to be the equivalent of "er.." - and, indeed, at one point succeeded a lengthy hesitant "too" by a short "to" as he continued having sorted out what to say) but Edward Stourton, whose speech patterns differ markedly, tended almost always to lengthen his "to", although not to the extent of Humphreys' delaying "too", or to the extent that they would generally be confused with the words "too" or "two". [1] Not "Tooday". SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ >Some folks profess a difficulty in hearing a > distinction between "to" and "too" Is there a difference? > >Some folks profess a difficulty in hearing a > > distinction between "to" and "too" > Is there a difference? As between "mutt" and "moot", as I wrote. It is a difference heard on television and radio so it surprises me greatly when folk on usenet claim not to hear it. SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ >>>> I wasn't talking about regional variations, though, but things >>>> like my pet hate "would of". (Which we now see increasingly even [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > distinction between "to" and "too", which to me seems as impossible as > confusing "mutt" and "moot". The usual confusion is between "moot" and "mute". SignatureJohn Briggs > > Not in all dialects. Some folks profess a difficulty in hearing a > > distinction between "to" and "too", which to me seems as impossible > > as confusing "mutt" and "moot". > The usual confusion is between "moot" and "mute". As in "coot" and "cute", d'ye mean? I haven't heard that confusion outside some USA accents. SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ > > > Not in all dialects. Some folks profess a difficulty in hearing a > > > distinction between "to" and "too", which to me seems as impossible [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > As in "coot" and "cute", d'ye mean? I haven't heard that confusion > outside some USA accents. Well it's a mute point, I suppose. :-) Cheers Tony SignatureTony Mountifield Work: tony@softins.co.uk - http://www.softins.co.uk Play: tony@mountifield.org - http://tony.mountifield.org >> As in "coot" and "cute", d'ye mean? I haven't heard that confusion >> outside some USA accents. > >Well it's a mute point, I suppose. :-) Londoners and East Anglians sometimes hypercorrect. I knew someone who referred to the "afternyoon" when trying to sound posh. SignaturePhil C. > >> As in "coot" and "cute", d'ye mean? I haven't heard that confusion > >> outside some USA accents. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Londoners and East Anglians sometimes hypercorrect. I knew someone who > referred to the "afternyoon" when trying to sound posh. My father is one of the few people I know who refers to a syuit, as well as inserting a "y" sound in various other words that escape me ATM (certainly not "afternoon"). It's not that he is trying to sound posh but because it is the way his parents said the words. Now it is just possible that Nan and Pop were trying to sound posh, despite both of them having lived in The Potteries all their lives - they were the least Bohemian artists I knew. > My father is one of the few people I know who refers to a > syuit, as well as inserting a "y" sound in various other words [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > posh, despite both of them having lived in The Potteries all their > lives - they were the least Bohemian artists I knew. Perhaps just regional variation. OED2 suggests both pronunciations, and some older spellings reflect the consonantal 'y' sound: (s(j)u:t) Forms: 34 sywte, 38 sute, 46 seute, sewte, suyt, 48 suyte, 49 suite, 56 suete, sewt, (3, 5 sowte, 35 soyte, 4 sivte, swete, sywete, sywyte, sout(e, 45 swte, suytte, 5 sevte, siewte, sutte, swtte, suytt, 5, 7 suet, 56 sut, Sc. soit(e, 57 Sc. soyt, 6 sueyt, sewet, -it, sutt, swt, shutte, soote, Sc. soitt, soytt, soyite, 67 Sc. suitt, 68 shute, 7 suett, seut, shuite, shuett, dial. zuit, illiterate shoot), 5 suit. I have never used the 'oo' version, and used to presume that it was an Americanism until you lot made me look it up. I learned English in the East Midlands in the 1950s and 60s. Giles In message <ni_If.46022$Rw6.17702@newsfe7-gui.ntli.net>, at 12:33:23 on Thu, 16 Feb 2006, John Briggs <john.briggs4@ntlworld.com> wibbled >The usual confusion is between "moot" and "mute". As in 'a mute point' = I'm not going to debate it ;-) SignaturePedt uk.announce ~ moderated group to announce news / events of specific interest to a wider uk.* readership than the group(s) which their subjects would naturally place them. See charter at <http://www.usenet.org.uk/uk.announce.html> > In message <ni_If.46022$Rw6.17702@newsfe7-gui.ntli.net>, at 12:33:23 on > Thu, 16 Feb 2006, John Briggs <john.briggs4@ntlworld.com> wibbled > > >The usual confusion is between "moot" and "mute". > > As in 'a mute point' = I'm not going to debate it ;-) Swan-upmanship? >> >I wasn't talking about regional variations, though, but things like my >> >pet hate "would of". (Which we now see increasingly even in written [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >should usually be able to distinguish "rows" from "rose" by the >sense, even though they sound identical. Yes, but John Hall implied that he heard this in speech before he saw it in writing. Perhaps he does hear people say /wUdQv/ instead of /wUd@v/ [using SAMPA notation] but I've never noticed this. [SAMPA: http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/home/sampa/english.htm] SignaturePhilip Baker > Yes, but John Hall implied that he heard this in speech before he saw > it in writing. Perhaps he does hear people say /wUdQv/ instead of > /wUd@v/ [using SAMPA notation] but I've never noticed this. [SAMPA: > http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/home/sampa/english.htm] SAMPA is itself quite confusing since it offers two different symbols (V and U) for vowels which are indistinguishable to me in the examples given (cut & put). There appears also to be no representation of the diphthong used in "weight". SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ >>Yes, but John Hall implied that he heard this in speech before he saw >>it in writing. Perhaps he does hear people say /wUdQv/ instead of [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > given (cut & put). There appears also to be no representation of the > diphthong used in "weight". For me the vowel sounds in "cut" and "put" are quite distinct - the same as the vowel sounds in "butter" and "book" respectively. Although I will admitt that in a Manchester/Salford accenbt the sounds are indistingushable. Regards, Einde O'Callaghan > > SAMPA is itself quite confusing since it offers two different > > symbols (V and U) for vowels which are indistinguishable to me in [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Although I will admitt that in a Manchester/Salford accenbt the > sounds are indistingushable. (So my first attempt did get through.) Unfortunately, providing "butter" and "book" would be no more help than "cut" and "put" for someone who pronounces these vowels the same except for the old joke about "bread in batter". I take it, then, that SAMPA symbol "V" is to be pronounced approximately as "a". Now all I need is a combination of symbols for the "ei" in "weight" and "eight"; unfortunately SAMPA "eI" seems to be used for the long "a" sound. SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ >>> SAMPA is itself quite confusing since it offers two different >>> symbols (V and U) for vowels which are indistinguishable to me in [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > and "eight"; unfortunately SAMPA "eI" seems to be used for the long > "a" sound. How does "weight" differ from "wait"? SignatureJohn Briggs > > Now all I need is a combination of symbols for the "ei" in "weight" > > and "eight"; unfortunately SAMPA "eI" seems to be used for the long > > "a" sound. > How does "weight" differ from "wait"? "Wait", for me, has a single long "a" sound, as in "mate"; "weight" has a diphthong: long broad "e" gliding into an "i". SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ > "Wait", for me, has a single long "a" sound, as in "mate"; "weight" has > a diphthong: long broad "e" gliding into an "i". Interesting - for me, a speaker of southern English, wait, mate and weight have identical vowel sounds, just like cut and put do for you (which are quite distinct for me). Cheers Tony SignatureTony Mountifield Work: tony@softins.co.uk - http://www.softins.co.uk Play: tony@mountifield.org - http://tony.mountifield.org > > "Wait", for me, has a single long "a" sound, as in "mate"; "weight" > > has a diphthong: long broad "e" gliding into an "i". > Interesting - for me, a speaker of southern English, wait, mate and > weight have identical vowel sounds, just like cut and put do for you > (which are quite distinct for me). You don't know the half of it; in much of Yorkshire, weight, meat and right all have near identical vowel sounds. SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ At 12:07:47 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> wrote in <4dfb1b2c5enospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: >> > "Wait", for me, has a single long "a" sound, as in "mate"; "weight" >> > has a diphthong: long broad "e" gliding into an "i". [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >You don't know the half of it; in much of Yorkshire, weight, meat and >right all have near identical vowel sounds. That's just because Yorkshire folk are too mean to use a full range of vowels when only a couple will do. SignatureMolly Mockford They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) > At 12:07:47 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> > wrote in <4dfb1b2c5enospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: > >You don't know the half of it; in much of Yorkshire, weight, meat > >and right all have near identical vowel sounds. > That's just because Yorkshire folk are too mean to use a full range > of vowels when only a couple will do. Now, now, Molly! You know very well that Yorkshire folk are the most generous in the world. The reputation for meanness is only because of confusion with the Scotch. SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ At 21:33:46 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> wrote in <4dfb4e8c9bnospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: >> At 12:07:47 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> >> wrote in <4dfb1b2c5enospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >generous in the world. The reputation for meanness is only because of >confusion with the Scotch. Definition of a Yorkshireman: A Scotsman with all the generosity squeezed out of him. SignatureMolly Mockford They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) > At 21:33:46 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> > wrote in <4dfb4e8c9bnospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: > >Now, now, Molly! You know very well that Yorkshire folk are the most > >generous in the world. The reputation for meanness is only because > >of confusion with the Scotch. > Definition of a Yorkshireman: A Scotsman with all the generosity > squeezed out of him. Well, I suppose we're not as much given to wearing frilly skirts as those heel and toe ragtime dancers. SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ At 22:52:09 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> wrote in <4dfb55d5fcnospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: >> At 21:33:46 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> >> wrote in <4dfb4e8c9bnospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >Well, I suppose we're not as much given to wearing frilly skirts as >those heel and toe ragtime dancers. No, not so much into having a good time, I guess. "Life - it's to be got through as soon as possible" (Yorkshire motto) SignatureMolly Mockford They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) > At 22:52:09 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> > wrote in <4dfb55d5fcnospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: > >> At 21:33:46 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David > >> <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> wrote in [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >Well, I suppose we're not as much given to wearing frilly skirts as > >those heel and toe ragtime dancers. > No, not so much into having a good time, I guess. "Life - it's to be > got through as soon as possible" (Yorkshire motto) You're very inventive tonight, Molly. New shipment of gin arrived today? SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ At 23:09:25 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> wrote in <4dfb574db5nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: >> At 22:52:09 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> >> wrote in <4dfb55d5fcnospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > >You're very inventive tonight, Molly. New shipment of gin arrived today? And the lob falls just behind the baseline, David having been totally unable to smash it back despite his best efforts... SignatureMolly Mockford They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) > At 23:09:25 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> > wrote in <4dfb574db5nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: > >> At 22:52:09 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David > >> <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> wrote in [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > >You're very inventive tonight, Molly. New shipment of gin arrived > >today? > And the lob falls just behind the baseline, David having been totally > unable to smash it back despite his best efforts... I could of (and would of) but obviously my racket's not as highly strung. SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ At 09:33:37 on Sun, 19 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> wrote in <4dfb9073d2nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: >> At 23:09:25 on Sat, 18 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> >> wrote in <4dfb574db5nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] >I could of (and would of) but obviously my racket's not as highly >strung. And I'm not going to say "balls"... SignatureMolly Mockford They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) > > > Now all I need is a combination of symbols for the "ei" in "weight" > > > and "eight"; unfortunately SAMPA "eI" seems to be used for the long [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > "Wait", for me, has a single long "a" sound, as in "mate"; "weight" has > a diphthong: long broad "e" gliding into an "i". Are you by any chance from Sheffield or Rotherham? We have hours of fun at a friend's expense because she comes from Rotherham originally and manages to squeeze extra vowel sounds into the most ordinary words. "Green" seems to have three syllables. Just listen to Charlotte Green reading the news on Radio 4 and you'll hear what I me-ee-ean. > > > > Now all I need is a combination of symbols for the "ei" in > > > > "weight" and "eight"; unfortunately SAMPA "eI" seems to be used [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > "Wait", for me, has a single long "a" sound, as in "mate"; "weight" > > has a diphthong: long broad "e" gliding into an "i". > Are you by any chance from Sheffield or Rotherham? No, thank the gods, not that far south! > We have hours of fun at a friend's expense because she comes from > Rotherham originally and manages to squeeze extra vowel sounds into > the most ordinary words. "Green" seems to have three syllables. Just > listen to Charlotte Green reading the news on Radio 4 and you'll hear > what I me-ee-ean. I should imagine your friend finds your speech very odd but maybe she has better manners? I, on the other hand, am always splitting my sides at the tonsil-twisting strangulations emanating from various southern parts. But what synchronicity that you should mention the sexy toned Charlotte at the very time that I was composing a post partly about her! SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ > > > > > Now all I need is a combination of symbols for the "ei" in > > > > > "weight" and "eight"; unfortunately SAMPA "eI" seems to be used [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > I should imagine your friend finds your speech very odd but maybe she > has better manners? My friend, being an only child, was born to be teased, but she occasionally manages to give as good as she gets. She is, however, a very good friend. > I, on the other hand, am always splitting my sides at the > tonsil-twisting strangulations emanating from various southern parts. Well, if you count Sheffield as South, assuming you're not a Scot... > But what synchronicity that you should mention the sexy toned Charlotte > at the very time that I was composing a post partly about her! Mmm. Quite pleasing to look at too. Coincidence, or is she just never far from our thoughts? I'm only guessing at her origins, BTW. It's only because the aforementioned vocal quirk which she shares with my friend shines through her otherwise RP which makes me suspect that she may be from S.Yorks. > > But what synchronicity that you should mention the sexy toned > > Charlotte at the very time that I was composing a post partly about > > her! > Mmm. Quite pleasing to look at too. Coincidence, or is she just never > far from our thoughts? Preferable to Peter Donaldson any day. > I'm only guessing at her origins, BTW. It's only because the > aforementioned vocal quirk which she shares with my friend shines > through her otherwise RP which makes me suspect that she may be from > S.Yorks. I doubt it, not as a Tottenham Hotspur supporter. A quick search on Google reveals no place of birth, unlike the search for Mr Donaldson, which main point of interest seems to be his birth in Cairo in 1945. Yes, definitely prefer sexy Charlotte. SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ At 16:01:34 on Mon, 20 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> wrote in <4dfc37e22fnospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: >> Mmm. Quite pleasing to look at too. Coincidence, or is she just never >> far from our thoughts? > >Preferable to Peter Donaldson any day. Oi! I like Peter. SignatureMolly Mockford They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) > At 16:01:34 on Mon, 20 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> > wrote in <4dfc37e22fnospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: > >> Mmm. Quite pleasing to look at too. Coincidence, or is she just > >> never far from our thoughts? > > > >Preferable to Peter Donaldson any day. > Oi! I like Peter. Funny, I'd of thought Alvar Liddel would of been more too your taste. SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ At 00:04:24 on Tue, 21 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> wrote in <4dfc6473fanospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: >> At 16:01:34 on Mon, 20 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> >> wrote in <4dfc37e22fnospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >Funny, I'd of thought Alvar Liddel would of been more too your taste. <tone="dangerous">Exactly how old do you think that I am?</tone> SignatureMolly Mockford They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) >> Funny, I'd of thought Alvar Liddel would of been more too your taste. > <tone="dangerous">Exactly how old do you think that I am?</tone> Remember Komrad Voss Bark? I assumed it was 'Komrad' because with a name like that, he had to be a communist. Also, in the recent era of Gorbachev, the Russian guy (he would have been their foreign secretary, except that all their secrataries are foreign) was called Nickel Irish Cough. Paul Burke > At 00:04:24 on Tue, 21 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> > wrote in <4dfc6473fanospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: > >> At 16:01:34 on Mon, 20 Feb 2006, David > >> <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> wrote in [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > > >Funny, I'd of thought Alvar Liddel would of been more too your taste. > <tone="dangerous">Exactly how old do you think that I am?</tone> Oh dear, Molly! I assure you that age, like sex, never enters my thoughts when I post. No, it was purely his enunciation that I thought would be more pleasing to a discerning and cultured English user such as your good self. (How about Douglas Smith?) SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ At 09:18:56 on Tue, 21 Feb 2006, David <nospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid> wrote in <4dfc97093anospam@nomaps.amnops.invalid>: >Oh dear, Molly! I assure you that age, like sex, never enters my >thoughts when I post. Ah yes, I've heard about these blokes who sit down at their computers and forget all about human contact for days on end. > No, it was purely his enunciation that I thought >would be more pleasing to a discerning and cultured English user such >as your good self. I have, I suppose, heard the odd crackly recording of Alvar Liddell, but the main impression I have of him is that I was told he had to wear black tie in order to read the news on radio. I find Peter Donaldson's enunciation pleasing, and if you put your hand on his shoulder when he's talking you can feel the resonance - the man's a sound-box on legs. >(How about Douglas Smith?) Now, I do admit to going back as far as Round the Horne. SignatureMolly Mockford They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin (My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.) > Now, I do admit to going back as far as Round the Horne. Oo-er Missus! SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ [Snip] A comment on Austria? SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ >I have, I suppose, heard the odd crackly recording of Alvar Liddell, but >the main impression I have of him is that I was told he had to wear >black tie in order to read the news on radio. What I didn't realise until recently was that he was of Swedish extraction. Article by his son Marcus: http://www.whirligig-tv.co.uk/tv/memories/snippets/snippets19.htm It is perhaps fortunate that he, rather than his brother, went into news reading. The British public might have had some difficulty with the first name Yngve. SignaturePeter Duncanson UK (posting from u.c.l.e) >>>SAMPA is itself quite confusing since it offers two different >>>symbols (V and U) for vowels which are indistinguishable to me in [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > I take it, then, that SAMPA symbol "V" is to be pronounced > approximately as "a". For me the sounds are quite different. Although the position of the tongue is similar the lips are much more rounded for teh sound in "butter", but the mouth is much more open than in "book" (the tongue position is also slightly different here). Regards, Einde O'Callaghan > Now all I need is a combination of symbols for the "ei" in "weight" and > "eight"; unfortunately SAMPA "eI" seems to be used for the long "a" > sound. >> Yes, but John Hall implied that he heard this in speech before he saw >> it in writing. Perhaps he does hear people say /wUdQv/ instead of [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >given (cut & put). There appears also to be no representation of the >diphthong used in "weight". If SAMPA is confusing it is because the English vowel system is complex and there are wide variations between accents. There is another factor: SAMPA is a transliteration of the International Phonetic Association's alphabet [IPA] into ASCII. English speakers are unused to IPA because it is rarely used in pronouncing dictionaries - unlike French dictionaries which always seem to use it. (weight is /weIt/ - a good example of the confusion because in some accents this phoneme is a not a diphthong). SignaturePhilip Baker > >SAMPA is itself quite confusing since it offers two different > >symbols (V and U) for vowels which are indistinguishable to me in > >the examples given (cut & put). There appears also to be no > >representation of the diphthong used in "weight". > If SAMPA is confusing it is because the English vowel system is > complex and there are wide variations between accents. There is [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > it. (weight is /weIt/ - a good example of the confusion because in > some accents this phoneme is a not a diphthong). I agree that wight should be /weIt/ but since "raise" is given as an example of "eI" and I've never, ever, heard that pronounced "reh-iz", only as a pure long vowel, the system seems to fail. SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ > I agree that wight should be /weIt/ but since "raise" is given as an > example of "eI" and I've never, ever, heard that pronounced "reh-iz", Not even on the BBC or ITV national news? > only as a pure long vowel, the system seems to fail. If I try to say "raise" with a pure long vowel, it makes me think of a Leeds accent or similar. Cheers Tony SignatureTony Mountifield Work: tony@softins.co.uk - http://www.softins.co.uk Play: tony@mountifield.org - http://tony.mountifield.org >> I agree that wight should be /weIt/ but since "raise" is given as an >> example of "eI" and I've never, ever, heard that pronounced "reh-iz", [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > If I try to say "raise" with a pure long vowel, it makes me think > of a Leeds accent or similar. "raise" and "raze"? SignatureJohn Briggs > >> I agree that wight should be /weIt/ but since "raise" is given as an > >> example of "eI" and I've never, ever, heard that pronounced "reh-iz", [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > "raise" and "raze"? For me, almost identical. In "raise", the first half of the diphthong is longer than the second, and in "raze" the opposite is true. Cheers Tony SignatureTony Mountifield Work: tony@softins.co.uk - http://www.softins.co.uk Play: tony@mountifield.org - http://tony.mountifield.org > > I agree that wight should be /weIt/ but since "raise" is given as > > an example of "eI" and I've never, ever, heard that pronounced > > "reh-iz", > Not even on the BBC or ITV national news? I don't recall hearing any "i" component to any "raise" type words on the national news. I've probably heard it in strong local accents. > > only as a pure long vowel, the system seems to fail. > If I try to say "raise" with a pure long vowel, it makes me think of > a Leeds accent or similar. Well, I'm only some 20 miles south of there. SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ (Sorry if this appears twice; I first sent it at 10:07 and it hasn't got back to me.) > Yes, but John Hall implied that he heard this in speech before he saw > it in writing. Perhaps he does hear people say /wUdQv/ instead of > /wUd@v/ [using SAMPA notation] but I've never noticed this. [SAMPA: > http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/home/sampa/english.htm] SAMPA is itself quite confusing since it offers two different symbols (V and U) for vowels which are indistinguishable to me in the examples given (cut & put). There appears also to be no representation of the diphthong used in "weight". SignatureDavid - toro-danyo atcost uku fullstop co fullstop uk http://www.toro-danyo.uku.co.uk/ John Hall a écrit : > >In my country, you can't get a decent job if you don't speak at least > >good English. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > particularly from a relative, a friend, > an acquaintance, or a stranger." Franklin P Jones >From wich country are you? I leave in south of France but i born in Italy. >John Hall a écrit : > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >>From wich country are you? I leave in south of France but i born in >Italy. I'm from Britain myself, as the From and Reply-To addresses of my posts here would suggest. SignatureJohn Hall "Honest criticism is hard to take, particularly from a relative, a friend, an acquaintance, or a stranger." Franklin P Jones > >>From wich country are you? I leave in south of France but i born in > >Italy. > > I'm from Britain myself, as the From and Reply-To addresses of my posts > here would suggest. I am not from Niue, as the 'From:' and 'Reply-To:' addresses of my posts here would suggest. Giles John Hall a écrit : > >John Hall a écrit : > > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > particularly from a relative, a friend, > an acquaintance, or a stranger." Franklin P Jones May be it's not necessary to speak perfect English. Italians speaks with hands and if this not very important to supply for a job, it's helpfull to try to find girlfriends. They are supposed to love men who can talk with hands. isn't ? |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2012 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.