Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us
Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network
Home
Discussion GroupsEnglish UsageBritish EnglishESL Teaching
Learnglish.com
Contact UsLink To UsSearch & Site Map

Discussion Groups / British English / August 2008



Tip: Looking for answers? Try searching our database.

Dr WHO - etymology of Daleks

Thread view: 
Enable EMail Alerts  Start New Thread
Thread rating: 
FCS - 26 Aug 2008 18:04 GMT
I remember at school there was a combined
volume of "Billy Liar" and "The Loneliness of
The Long Distance Runner" ubiquitous to the
"English Rooms". I thought the latter to be
the better story, better written; but Billy Liar
had been made into a film and it should be a
good preparation for comparing films to books
in what would now be our GCSE curriculum,
so it got both read-aloud, and screened, in front
of an audience.

One reason, perhaps, was its "satire" of the
medallion-sporting down-to-earth traditional
business type - Councillor Duxbury - as well
as its use of localish accents, including made
up dialect, and it being written by a localish
writer.

Certainly the character Shadrach, co-patron
of Shadrach and Duxbury funeral services, had
an affected Home Counties elision toward
understating syllables into diphthongs with
the repeated use of "vair" as an intensifier in
adjectivals - "vair" = "very" for those unfamiliar
with the texts, though any subtle allusions or
perpendiculars to Cinderella-style fairy stories
were, and indeed remain, lost on me.

Oranges do figure prominently though, and
certainly the dusty, harsh sunlight of the
fundamentalist assembly hall in Oranges
Are Not The Only Fruit, which followed it
some two decades or so later draws from
observations on comparable proprieties in
places.

But he was influential, and not just in The Regions,
was Willis Hall, who later went on to adapt
Barbara Euphan Todd's Worzel Gummidge
series of insufferably anachronistic everyday
children fairly well for a 1980s audience, and who
also wrote Billy Liar (IIRC).

And television being less a case of who you know
these days, as old Jezza insists, as who you can
interest, Billy Liar's synchronicity with the emerging
Science Fiction light drama Dr WHO amid a rapidly-
changing society in which the firmest bastions of
propriety romped with the most radical agents of
persistent tradition dressed up as change in Swinging
London, we're told.

Certainly Modern Mathematics was hitting schools
all over the place, and the Reithian values of a
bow-tie for the evening news called into question.

It was even the era in which The Queen's English
was formally identified as a dialect with accent,
and the prospect of worldwide, possibly eventual
cosmic, galactic and universal localised broadcasting
was muted over port, cigars and loosened ties
in the footlit halls of prestige Universities where
exciting new opportunities to make use of propagatory
media to achieve philosophical and economic ends
were no doubt debated with gusto with a sneaky
insecurity about the fact the blighters might know
some Marxian counter-ideals, in Scotland.

But the collapsed diphthong - in which a diphthong
is formed to provide minimal phonetic cues to a
longer word - from Billy Liar does, still, come over
as an, albeit affected, social semiotic pertaining
to the dignity and responsibility of assumed social
status. It reminds me of Solihull, Cholmondley,
Bicester and Featherstonehaugh simultaneously;
all pronunciations a reliable acculturated BBC anchor
or links man would be expected to know off pat
and deliver without missing a beat.

As such, and if there is a link between "Daleks" and
widespread post-war fears of robotic, programmed
drones burdened with limited and monotonous, if
hysterical, language capabilities, then can anyone
refer me to any satires of Dr WHO itself in which
this element is perhaps given the prominence it
deserves.

Just let us not forget two languages have officially
died this year alone already, and that's only because
they had brief notes about them published in some
journal or other prior to this happening--the ones we
don't know about we are in danger of exterminating
far past the point of lexical vestigiality, thugs that
we are.

G DAEB
COPYRIGHT (C) 2008 SIPSTON
--
Enzo Matrix - 26 Aug 2008 18:49 GMT
> As such, and if there is a link between "Daleks" and
> widespread post-war fears of robotic, programmed
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> this element is perhaps given the prominence it
> deserves.

The Daleks were named so because Terry Nation looked at his copies of
Encyclopedia Britannica and saw that one volume was labelled "DAL-LEK".

Signature

Enzo

I wear the cheese. It does not wear me.

Jeff Lawrence - 26 Aug 2008 18:53 GMT
>> As such, and if there is a link between "Daleks" and
>> widespread post-war fears of robotic, programmed
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> The Daleks were named so because Terry Nation looked at his copies of
> Encyclopedia Britannica and saw that one volume was labelled "DAL-LEK".

Myth!
http://www.whoniverse.org/monsters/daleks.php
"'They were named after a set of encyclopedias' - At the time, writer Terry
Nation told the press that he named them after an encyclopedia labelled
DAL-LEK, but in fact he simply made up the name."
Cheers
Jeff
Enzo Matrix - 26 Aug 2008 19:00 GMT
>>> As such, and if there is a link between "Daleks" and
>>> widespread post-war fears of robotic, programmed
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> Terry Nation told the press that he named them after an encyclopedia
> labelled DAL-LEK, but in fact he simply made up the name."

Well...   if Terry says it was so but later retracted the story then his
credibility is shot. Who knows *what* to believe?   :-D

Signature

Enzo

I wear the cheese. It does not wear me.

gavin - 26 Aug 2008 19:10 GMT
>>>> As such, and if there is a link between "Daleks" and
>>>> widespread post-war fears of robotic, programmed
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
> Well...   if Terry says it was so but later retracted the story then his
> credibility is shot. Who knows *what* to believe?   :-D
gavin - 26 Aug 2008 19:20 GMT
>>>>> As such, and if there is a link between "Daleks" and
>>>>> widespread post-war fears of robotic, programmed
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>> Well...   if Terry says it was so but later retracted the story then his
>> credibility is shot. Who knows *what* to believe?   :-D

Ooops - hit the wrong keys!
Jeff Lawrence - 26 Aug 2008 19:23 GMT
>>>> As such, and if there is a link between "Daleks" and
>>>> widespread post-war fears of robotic, programmed
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
> Well...   if Terry says it was so but later retracted the story then his
> credibility is shot. Who knows *what* to believe?   :-D

Apparently he wanted to make it "more romantic". I always thought it was an
acronym.
Cheers
Jeff
Peter Duncanson - 26 Aug 2008 20:16 GMT
>>>> As such, and if there is a link between "Daleks" and
>>>> widespread post-war fears of robotic, programmed
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>Well...   if Terry says it was so but later retracted the story then his
>credibility is shot. Who knows *what* to believe?   :-D

Surely the inventor of the Daleks is entitled to use a Tardis to
travel back in time to change the origin of the name?

Signature

Peter Duncanson, UK
(in uk.culture.language.english)

John Briggs - 26 Aug 2008 19:24 GMT
>> As such, and if there is a link between "Daleks" and
>> widespread post-war fears of robotic, programmed
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> Encyclopedia Britannica and saw that one volume was labelled
> "DAL-LEK".

DAL-EK - except that it wasn't Britannica, and I have never found an
encyclopaedia with such a label. I think we have to conclude that it is a
myth.
Signature

John Briggs

Enzo Matrix - 26 Aug 2008 19:27 GMT
>>> As such, and if there is a link between "Daleks" and
>>> widespread post-war fears of robotic, programmed
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> encyclopaedia with such a label. I think we have to conclude that it
> is a myth.

Don't care.  It's a nice story!  :-D

"When the legend becomes fact, print the legend."

Signature

Enzo

I wear the cheese. It does not wear me.

Sam Nelson - 26 Aug 2008 20:42 GMT
> > As such, and if there is a link between "Daleks" and
> > widespread post-war fears of robotic, programmed
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> The Daleks were named so because Terry Nation looked at his copies of
> Encyclopedia Britannica and saw that one volume was labelled "DAL-LEK".

Bpllocks.  That myth was debumked in the 10th-anniversary magazine, in
1973.
Signature

SAm.

John Hall - 26 Aug 2008 19:14 GMT
In article
<e4e096db-b2b8-414f-8648-3a13cc46639a@z6g2000pre.googlegroups.com>,
<snip>
>But he was influential, and not just in The Regions,
>was Willis Hall, who later went on to adapt
>Barbara Euphan Todd's Worzel Gummidge
>series of insufferably anachronistic everyday
>children fairly well for a 1980s audience, and who
>also wrote Billy Liar (IIRC).
<snip>

You remember incorrectly. "Billy Liar" was written by Keith Waterhouse.
Signature

John Hall
               "Hegel was right when he said that we learn from history
                that man can never learn anything from history."
                                         George Bernard Shaw (1856-1950)

John Briggs - 26 Aug 2008 19:31 GMT
> In article
> <e4e096db-b2b8-414f-8648-3a13cc46639a@z6g2000pre.googlegroups.com>,
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> You remember incorrectly. "Billy Liar" was written by Keith
> Waterhouse.

Willis Hall co-wrote the play (credited as co-writer after Waterhouse) and
TV series, and is credited as primary co-writer of the film screenplay.
Signature

John Briggs

John Hall - 26 Aug 2008 20:21 GMT
>> In article
>> <e4e096db-b2b8-414f-8648-3a13cc46639a@z6g2000pre.googlegroups.com>,
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>and TV series, and is credited as primary co-writer of the film
>screenplay.

Thanks. I was thinking of the novel.
Signature

John Hall
               "Hegel was right when he said that we learn from history
                that man can never learn anything from history."
                                         George Bernard Shaw (1856-1950)

John Briggs - 26 Aug 2008 19:46 GMT
> In article
> <e4e096db-b2b8-414f-8648-3a13cc46639a@z6g2000pre.googlegroups.com>,
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> You remember incorrectly. "Billy Liar" was written by Keith
> Waterhouse.

Worzel Gummidge was also a collaboration with Waterhouse.

You would have done better to query the grammatical structure of that
sentence :-)
Signature

John Briggs

John Hall - 26 Aug 2008 20:23 GMT
>> In article
>> <e4e096db-b2b8-414f-8648-3a13cc46639a@z6g2000pre.googlegroups.com>,
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>You would have done better to query the grammatical structure of that
>sentence :-)

Life's too short to attempt to correct FCS's grammar. :)
Signature

John Hall
               "Hegel was right when he said that we learn from history
                that man can never learn anything from history."
                                         George Bernard Shaw (1856-1950)

John Briggs - 26 Aug 2008 19:51 GMT
> But the collapsed diphthong - in which a diphthong
> is formed to provide minimal phonetic cues to a
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> or links man would be expected to know off pat
> and deliver without missing a beat.

"Featherstonehaugh" is a myth.
Signature

John Briggs

John Briggs - 26 Aug 2008 19:56 GMT
> But he was influential, and not just in The Regions,
> was Willis Hall, who later went on to adapt
> Barbara Euphan Todd's Worzel Gummidge
> series of insufferably anachronistic everyday
> children fairly well for a 1980s audience, and who
> also wrote Billy Liar (IIRC).

Willis Hall is probably best known for "The Long and the Short and the
Tall", although the film screenplay is credited to Wolf Mankowitz (Willis
Hall credited for "Additional dialogue" - there must be a story there...)
and the director was Barry Norman's father.
Signature

John Briggs

Halmyre - 26 Aug 2008 21:46 GMT
In article <e4e096db-b2b8-414f-8648-
3a13cc46639a@z6g2000pre.googlegroups.com>, sipston_777@my-deja.com says...
> But the collapsed diphthong - in which a diphthong
> is formed to provide minimal phonetic cues to a
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> or links man would be expected to know off pat
> and deliver without missing a beat.

So how is Solihull pronounced then? I always think of it as "solly-hull"...

Signature

Halmyre

That's you that is.

Einde O'Callaghan - 26 Aug 2008 22:55 GMT
> In article <e4e096db-b2b8-414f-8648-
> 3a13cc46639a@z6g2000pre.googlegroups.com>, sipston_777@my-deja.com says...
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>
> So how is Solihull pronounced then? I always think of it as "solly-hull"...

According to Wikipedia it's pronounced that way and also with a long "o".

Regards, Einde O'Callaghan
Sam Nelson - 27 Aug 2008 08:35 GMT
> > So how is Solihull pronounced then? I always think of it as "solly-hull"...
> >
> According to Wikipedia it's pronounced that way and also with a long "o".
>
> Regards, Einde O'Callaghan

A lesson on pronunciation from someone called `Einde'?  Irony, I calls it.
Signature

SAm.

Einde O'Callaghan - 27 Aug 2008 12:23 GMT
>>> So how is Solihull pronounced then? I always think of it as "solly-hull"...
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> A lesson on pronunciation from someone called `Einde'?  Irony, I calls it.

No - a non-English name spelled in the original form.

Regards, Einde O'Callaghan
Sam Nelson - 27 Aug 2008 12:49 GMT
> >>> So how is Solihull pronounced then? I always think of it as "solly-hull"...
> >>>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> No - a non-English name spelled in the original form.

Can't take a tease, then?
Signature

SAm.

AC - 27 Aug 2008 01:49 GMT
> In article <e4e096db-b2b8-414f-8648-
> 3a13cc46639a@z6g2000pre.googlegroups.com>, sipston_777@my-deja.com says...
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> So how is Solihull pronounced then? I always think of it as
> "solly-hull"...

I'd go with Soiled Hole.

AC
Halmyre - 27 Aug 2008 07:23 GMT
> > In article <e4e096db-b2b8-414f-8648-
> > 3a13cc466...@z6g2000pre.googlegroups.com>, sipston_...@my-deja.com says...
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

That's nice to know, but how do you pronounce Solihull?

--
Halmyre
Mike Henry - 27 Aug 2008 18:18 GMT
>That's nice to know, but how do you pronounce Solihull?

Me? Sole-ee-hull, with the L in sole pronounced the same way Michael
Howard says the 2nd part of people ("pee-pull") :-)
Halmyre - 27 Aug 2008 20:55 GMT
> >That's nice to know, but how do you pronounce Solihull?
>
> Me? Sole-ee-hull, with the L in sole pronounced the same way Michael
> Howard says the 2nd part of people ("pee-pull") :-)

Solly-hull, sole-ee-hull, who cares, let's just call the whole thing off.

Signature

Halmyre

That's you that is.

John Briggs - 28 Aug 2008 00:12 GMT
>> In
>> <b6623d84-65d8-4a1a-a181-641710546963@s50g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> Solly-hull, sole-ee-hull, who cares, let's just call the whole thing
> off.

Does anyone ever say 'potahto'?
Signature

John Briggs

Halmyre - 28 Aug 2008 16:45 GMT
> >> In
> >> <b6623d84-65d8-4a1a-a181-641710546963@s50g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> Does anyone ever say 'potahto'?

About as often as I say "tom-ay-toe"

Signature

Halmyre

That's you that is.

John Briggs - 28 Aug 2008 18:26 GMT
>>>> In
>>>> <b6623d84-65d8-4a1a-a181-641710546963@s50g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>
> About as often as I say "tom-ay-toe"

Yes, but I said *anyone*.
Signature

John Briggs

 
Sign In
Join
My Latest Posts
My Monitored Threads
My Blog
My Photo Gallery
My Profile
My Homepage

Start New Thread
Enable EMail Alerts
Rate this Thread



©2012 Advenet LLC   Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.